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coombes

New PC

43 posts in this topic

Well having struggled thus far with a PC built prior to this games release, I think its finally time for an upgrade: Ok this is the spec of what im looking to build (on a very tight budget):

CPU: AMD AM2 Athlon 64 5600+ Dual Core 2.8GHz

MoBo: Abit KN9-S

Memory: 2GB (2x1GB) CorsairTwinX XMS2, DDR2 PC2-6400 (800)

Gfx: 512Mb Asus 7600GS

HDD: 2x 250 Gb HGST SATA

Optical: 2x Dual Layer DVD RW SATA

The last part is of course the OS, Im going with XP Pro for 2 reasons:

1) I trust it more than Vista in terms of stability and compatibility

2) I already have spare licenses here

the question is 32 or 64 bit ? What are the advantages of the 64bit ? (only ever used 32bit before)

comments and suggestions please

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The CPU is great. I have a 5200+ and I have a lot of power to spare.

Can't say anything about the gfx card though since I don't know that much of the nvidia cards but if you can spare a bit more money I'd suggest you go for the 7900 series OR an ATI X1950 Pro which is a great card for its price.

When it comes to XP I say go for 32-bit. There are no advantages with 64-bit XP, at least not with this game. You will more likely end up with driver problems since not all hardware have up to date drivers for X64. The 64-bit support is better in vista than in XP so go with 32-bit.

That's my suggestion.

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Based on suggestions I've received about the new system I am planning to build, I agree with Munchkin about the video card.

I was originally thinking about a SATA DVD writer, but Merlin51 suggested that would be a waste of money. Here's what he said about it in my thread:

How much is the SATA dvd drive costing you?

And does the mobo have any PATA(IDE) controller on it at all?

Reason i ask is an SATA channel is kind of wasted on a slow device like a dvd drive.

(yea dvd's are slow)

You could save the SATA channels for hard drives.

A normal ATA100 dvd/r drive will run just as fast.

Last i checked it was less money as well.

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I believe that darg is in the UK. If you give him how much you have for your budget he can probably give you links you can just click and build with. He'll probably see this thread soon.

Don't buy the 7600gs. At least get a 7600gt. The gs is way slower performance wise and the cost is not much more for the GT. They are selling for $89 in the states with mail in rebates they're $75. If you can spend at least $100-$150 on the video card you want an ATI x1950gt or pro. They have twice the memory bus of the mid range gforces.

I've built with the abit k9n ultra. It was a very stable board after I updated the bios. You'll probably get a newer version that's already been updated.

I ran a single core 3800 AMD64 @2.6 /ddr900 on it. Stable for over 1 year.

I really don't see any reason to go AMD right now. There's lower priced core2duo's out that when slightly overclocked will outperform anything AMD's got and you'll have a newer platform MB that's poised to be upgradeable with newer cpu's into the future. AMD needed to come out with an answer to the core2duo last Christmas and I'm still waiting. What they have out right now barely competes and it's a design stretched to it's limit. The core2duo has headroom to spare.

So you're on a budget check out these deals.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116036

I've seen these overclock and outbench a core2duo x6800 extreme.

This is the newest chipset out for the core2duo instead of the 1 1/2 year old design that you have. It's ready for the 45nm cpu's intel is coming out with this fall/winter. As you can see the price isn't much different.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128059

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from the supplier i use, i can get a 7600gt for about $16 more but is half the onboard ram. is this a better bet then to go for ?

edit: ooops my bad the 256gt is $80 more

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from the supplier i use' date=' i can get a 7600gt for about $16 more but is half the onboard ram. is this a better bet then to go for ?[/quote']

You don't really need a lot of RAM on the video card. Especially if you are playing WWIIOL. The amount that you get with the 7600gt is enough for WWIIOL and many other games. Plus I believe the ram on the 7600gs is slower than the one on the 7600gt. I have the 7600gt and it runs WWIIOL perfectly.

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- There is NO practical advantage to using Windows XP 64-bit.

- The extra video ram on your 7600GS is useless (the only situations it would help, at higher resolutions and in high-end games with ultra-res textures, wouldn't run well on that low-end card to begin with....the 512mb of ram is a trick, a marketing gimmick)

- The 7600GT with half the video memory will give you *FAR* superior performance.

Some very good links:

Compare any two video cards in a wide variety of games and benchmarks

http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics_2007.html

Compare any two CPUs in a wide variety of real world apps, games, and benchmarks

http://www23.tomshardware.com/cpu_2007.html

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ok price wise looking at intel a similar cpu to the amd i listed would be this

Intel Core 2 Duo E4500, S775, 2.2 GHz, 800MHz FSB, Allendale Core, 2MB Cache

coming in at $8 less

in terms of mobo, price wise something with an n-force 650 chipset is in a similar ball park in terms of cost, the P35's are double the price.

the gfx card is now an issue, my knowledge of ati cards is severly lacking, what would be an alternative to the 7600gt in ati form ?

The Sata optical drives are only $2 more per drive, i had originally opted for pata ones but as there was only 1 ide channel on the original board i thought if i was to add a 3rd or 4th drive it would be a dumb storage drive out of my current pc when it dies (which is sporting a 250gb pata)

Last time I actually built a pc was 2001 so im a little behind in technology, back then the 1ghz Athlon Axia cpu was quite good, now its a paper weight :D

edit: for similar money as the 7600gt i can get a ati x1950 pro. from what people have said this would be a better direction to go.

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The ATI x1950pro will significantly outperform the 7600gt. It's about equal to a 7950gt and a little faster than a 7900gs if you can find one of those. The x1950's are the sweet spot in the budget video card market right now. An ATI equal to the 7600gt would be the x1650xt but I think the 7600 is the better of those 2.

You can't find the lower end p35 gigabyte that I linked? It shouldn't be much different in price in the UK. If not a nvidia i650 would suffice. It's not the overclocker the p35 is though. I think I'd take an intel 965 chipset over the nvidia i650. They were nice boards. It was the chipset to get intel wise before these new p35's came out. Great overclockers.

There's the Asus P5B's and the Gigabyte DS3's. Either of these links would be a good alternative to the intel p35 chipset if it's out of your price range. You should be able to find either of these boards near $100.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131030

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128012

From the MB reviews of the Asus P5B.

Pros: I bough this board to go with an e4300. It is advertised by ASUS as a great overclocker and I have certainly had no trouble over-clocking the e4300. It is resting at 2.8ghz (312 Bus Speed) right now with vCore of 1.25 (BIOS setting) with PC Probe II Vcore reading of 1.12. I've had it up to a stable 3.0ghz Orthos stable on stock cooling but being conservative I backed up and settled on 2.8ghz for the time being. I still had plenty of room to move up. The Mobo was certainly not holding me back

Cons: I had to flash the BIOS to version 0806 in order for it to fully recognize the Core 2 Duo chip. That was a painless process and I was up and running in no time.

Other Thoughts: Excellent choice for a budget minded tinkerer who likes to do some over-clocking, doesn't need on-board wifi and doesn't feel the need to take over-clocking to the extreme. That being said, I have come no where close to the limit on how far up I could take this Mobo/CPU combo. Just waiting for an after-market CPU heat-sink / fan before heading on past 3.0 ghz

Make sure you get a new decent power supply of at least 500watts.

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the gigabit ds3's and asus p5's are coming in starting at $145 compared to $90 for the amd

the intel 965's are coming in starting at $115

As for gfx im going to go with the x1950pro, it comes in starting at $190 (yep stuff over here seems to be exspensive :D)

the PSU is a concern, unfortunatley im going to have to do same as i did last time which is run with the psu provided with the case (a 500w) and then upgrade to something better. I have been pleased with my old Enermax 350w so I may go up to 1 of their 500+w units

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You might not be looking at the right site. Wait till darg comes in here. He's always throwing out some really good links to deals in the UK. He might have a better place to order parts. Those prices seem a little high especially for them being in pounds right?

Make sure the power supply that comes with the case has an eps12volt 8 pin aux MB power plug. All the new MB from here on out will take one. The 4 pin works but they won't get the power they need and manufactures won't guarantee stability like that. Being an older design the P5B and the DS3 take the 4 pin aux power plug.

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You might not be looking at the right site. Wait till darg comes in here. He's always throwing out some really good links to deals in the UK. He might have a better place to order parts. Those prices seem a little high especially for them being in pounds right?

Make sure the power supply that comes with the case has an eps12 8 pin MB power plug. All the new MB from here on out will take one. The 4 pin works but they won't get the power they need and manufactures won't guarantee stability like that.

im doubling them up for to convert to dollars, gonna wait for darg to put up some links and see what they can come up with before ordering

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Sounds good to me, I have 2 7600 SLI'd and sli doesn’t do anything for this game right now it might in the future. I have 7600 I think it is awesome I think for this game I get good FPS and I have 3200 AMD, and 2 gig of ram. What you have going sounds good, I would go with a 32bit though if you only are planning to play this game.

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Sounds good to me' date=' I have 2 7600 SLI'd and sli doesn’t do anything for this game right now it might in the future. I have 7600 I think it is awesome I think for this game I get good FPS and I have 3200 AMD, and 2 gig of ram. What you have going sounds good, I would go with a 32bit though if you only are planning to play this game.[/quote']

to begin with it'll just be for this game, eq2 and eve plus the older standalone games (HL2, doom3 etc) that i play on my laptop, but will be expanded to try other games.

I have sitting on my desk 17 copies of xp pro, a mix of both 32 and 64 bit, so OS choice is simply what will perform better rather than performance vs cost :D

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You will gain nothing with 64-bit windows. Trust me on that.

What might happen is that some hardware doesn't work because there just aren't any up to date drivers. That's what happened to me when I tried X64.

Go with 32-bit. I can't imagine anyone disagreeing with me on that.

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The 32bit works better for this game I think. But if you are planning to play other games the 64bit will be a good choice just if you play this game with a 64bit it might cause you some problems.

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It's a good card. Nothing in the price range from nvidia is competing with the performance at this moment. The 7600gt is cheaper but slower and the 7900's if you can find one are more money and harder to find in a 512 meg version for a good price.

There's a few 7900gs's but only 256meg versions. It's a good alternative to the x1950pro. I think the pro is a little faster.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814143070

You can get by a lot cheaper if you get the 256meg version. There's also a gt instead of a pro. The only difference being the gt runs 75 mhz slower on the core clock. I've built one machine with the x1900gt and it overclocked up to pro speed no problem.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102094

For a while there they had x1950xt 256megs for $169 but they all sold out.

This one's not bad but it's only 256meg and more expensive than the x1950pro.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814143090

Check this out. I found the last 7950gt 512meg on the new parts market. It's only $199. I might consider this over the x1950pro if you're a real gforce fanboy. It's a cool fanless design too. It's not going to be much different performance wise though and it is a few dollars more.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3241598&CatId=1826

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Coombes what kind of overall budget in £ are you looking at here?

I'll spec you the best full rig I can at that price.

Do you already have a case, monitor, keyboard, mouse and speakers that you can use or do you want new ones of any of those?

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Coombes what kind of overall budget in £ are you looking at here?

I'll spec you the best full rig I can at that price.

Do you already have a case, monitor, keyboard, mouse and speakers that you can use or do you want new ones of any of those?

REALLY tight about £500, for a complete box (certain financial restraints means I have less than half what I would normally consider a decent budget), i can reuse monitor, mouse. keyboard from old machine.

Preferences are

2x HDD (however i am not sure if theres still a benefit of putting your page file on a seperate drive/channel) but I do like to store data on a seperate drive from my C:\ lets me mess about alot knowing if i mess the drive up i have all the drivers, AV, firewall setups etc on the other drive and I can at least have some protection before getting stuff online. I would also like the abilty to add an pata hdd if needed (if my current pc dies, i can attach its 250gb storage drive to the system)

2x dvd, least 1 that can write, makes certain tasks a ot quicker if i can read and write a dvd at the same time *cough* having both write capable would mean if 1 goes down i can be my normal lazy arsed self in replacing it without loosing write capabilities (i have spare but 2 would be even lazier for me :D)

Noise, I dont care if the fans at noisey or not (my current pc is a noisey bugger so paying that little more for silent isnt critical)

OS no need to incorporate this into the price, i have multiple legal copies of xp here i can use

Case, though fancy looking and easy to work with cases are very nice, as long as its a holds everything in place thats all that counts, even if i do have to undo 4 screws to get a drive out

sound, i will either just use onboard or reuse my audigy card from a couple years ago short term, this game is 1 of the few i play with sound

PSu, again this is a case of get something in short term and upgrade later (sadly my enermax psu will not be manly enough to reuse being only 350w)

edit: obviously im not going to be able to get anything near cutting edge but if you could see what im using now, you would know it is still a quantum leap forward **cough**1.2ghz athlon**cough**64mbgeforce3**cough** :D

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I believe that darg is in the UK. If you give him how much you have for your budget he can probably give you links you can just click and build with. He'll probably see this thread soon.

Don't buy the 7600gs. At least get a 7600gt. The gs is way slower performance wise and the cost is not much more for the GT. They are selling for $89 in the states with mail in rebates they're $75. If you can spend at least $100-$150 on the video card you want an ATI x1950gt or pro. They have twice the memory bus of the mid range gforces.

I've built with the abit k9n ultra. It was a very stable board after I updated the bios. You'll probably get a newer version that's already been updated.

I ran a single core 3800 AMD64 @2.6 /ddr900 on it. Stable for over 1 year.

I really don't see any reason to go AMD right now. There's lower priced core2duo's out that when slightly overclocked will outperform anything AMD's got and you'll have a newer platform MB that's poised to be upgradeable with newer cpu's into the future. AMD needed to come out with an answer to the core2duo last Christmas and I'm still waiting. What they have out right now barely competes and it's a design stretched to it's limit. The core2duo has headroom to spare.

So you're on a budget check out these deals.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116036

I've seen these overclock and outbench a core2duo x6800 extreme.

This is the newest chipset out for the core2duo instead of the 1 1/2 year old design that you have. It's ready for the 45nm cpu's intel is coming out with this fall/winter. As you can see the price isn't much different.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128059

I'm running a E2160 1.8ghz on a asrock board. It's running @ 2.4ghz and atm temp monitor shows 29c. It will clock a tad higher. Seems a good cpu for under 100 bucks.

Edit: After posting I decieded it was time to push things a mite more. I'm a tad above 2.6ghz now and temp only up 1c to 30c idle.

I'll leave it at that a few days then see how much more it's got.

As said it seems a good clocker :)

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