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Jimato

Intel or AMD Computer system

54 posts in this topic

This is what im getting towards the end of the month "providing everything goes well" and in my sig you can see what i am using now.

MB= http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813188024

CPU= http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115017

Ram 8gigs = http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148070 2x2 version is gone off of here but you get the idea.

GPU= http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814261006

Then eventually 4x150 raptors

This all goes into an Antec 900 case "that i have now" the sound card and psu will still be with it as well.

Other than an eventual video card upgrade or see what happens at the end of the month with the 9800's this should hold me for a few years.

Oh and the reason for the upgrade is for the newer games id like to play that are coming down the pike. My present setup works just fine for this game as it sits.

Wow, thats huge.

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I don't see the point of Raptors or those flash memory drives.

For 1/4 the price you can get a 500GB or 1TB WD drive that you'll barely notice a difference with. Granted you might shave a couple of seconds off your windows load time and you can dangle your e-penis around hardware noobs but it won't help you in game.

Money is better spent on a better CPU and GFX.

For the OP I'd go for the E6750, Abit IP35, Corsair 520W, and either the 3870 or 8800GT. Personally at go for the 3870 as you have the option for XFire in the future when they are cheaper.

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I don't see the point of Raptors or those flash memory drives.

For 1/4 the price you can get a 500GB or 1TB WD drive that you'll barely notice a difference with. Granted you might shave a couple of seconds off your windows load time and you can dangle your e-penis around hardware noobs but it won't help you in game.

Money is better spent on a better CPU and GFX.

For the OP I'd go for the E6750, Abit IP35, Corsair 520W, and either the 3870 or 8800GT. Personally at go for the 3870 as you have the option for XFire in the future when they are cheaper.

LOLOL i knew someone would be looking at my winky when i put that up lolol

It has nothing to do with the dreaded e-penis complex some have, it does have everything to do with not buying every bloody year like alot of people do and a few seconds is worth the time for myself.

This upgrade of mine has been in the works since December 2006 when i started to seriously consider it. I decided to wait til July 07 to do it. Then decided to hold off a bit more. Then got side swiped financially in August due to a death in the family and now just getting back up where i can do try this again.

Now with the price of ram so low,it seems now is the time to do this upgrade.

Since the op was curious which way to go i figured i would toss in my two cents. Don't you find a bit odd to have such a high powered psu in such a low end system for almost a year now?

As far as my sig is concerned, thats for beta testing purposes so Gophur doesn't beat me bloody because i keep forgetting to include what my system had when i make a report.

But if you feel you still need to look at Mr. Winky i will be more than happy to give out a detail report of my complete system once it is done in a couple of weeks. It's up to you. :D

btw, that has changed since i put that up im now looking at the wolfdale plus a pair of 8800gts's and 8gigs of ram still. Cost is 1220 plus roughly 18 s/h.

That will probably change again but that is the rough route i'm taking at this point.

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Hmm.. why wait then! :)

Overclocking as shown above I'm assuming will require a very good

fan or perhaps liquid cooling. I've been running a water cooler for my

current cpu years now and have had very good results with it!

S!

It was done with this heatsink and a high cfm fan.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835109125

As you can see they're out but there's comparable models. The Zerotherm nirvana 120mm is only about 1 degree behind it.

The new 45nm cpu's are very overclock friendly because along with the die shrink they benefit from an entirely new internal transistor design. It's supposed to prevent current leakage and allow for higher clocks than they previously were able to achieve. I think these 4.4ghz speeds we're seeing on air has to do with this new transistor as much as anything else.

Adapting your current water cooling setup to a new wolfdale would probably be as easy as buying an intel 775 socket water block to sub in for your AMD style one.

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CPUz_4401.png

The e8400 is just as good and it's about $75 less than the e8500's I've seen. Here's one hitting 4.4ghz.

The e8400 runs at 3.00ghz and the e8500 runs at 3.16ghz. They have very similar max overclocking potential. There e8400 seems to be the easiest 45nm dual core to find in stores too. The only real difference is $75 more cost and 1 higher number multiplier to play with. 9.5 for the e8500 I believe.

24/7 OC...??

CJ

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24/7 OC...??

CJ

This oc doesn't give you that more mhz at the end, the energy loss is so high, that it isn't really worth to oc that high, though looks great on a picture.

The optimum oc way for the 8400 cpu is around 3.6-3.8 ghz. Still fast enough for the moment.

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snippity

Well it's completely up to you whether or not you think the benefits of Raptor harddrives are worth it. I really couldn't justify the money for performance gained. How much are they going for these days anyway? Last I looked it was over $200 a drive. The same money could get you a 1TB WD drive.

Buying four of them just seems like a little bit of overkill unless you have cash falling out of your pockets.

I can see where you're coming from with the 8GB of RAM. I don't think any game will use over 2GB for a while but I bought another 2GB and now have 4 myself just because it was so cheap. Didn't notice a single bit of performance gain but it's nice to know that side of things won't need an upgrade for a while.

And I'm not the kind of person that upgrades every few months either. Stuck with my craptastic dell for 3 years before I realised the joy of custom building. Since then I've had the same CPU and case, RAM got an upgrade from the dell stuff, had two motherboards. Graphics are another matter as I bought a 7600GT AGP, sold that and bought a 7900GS PCI-E second hand for a massive £10 but managed to break it in the space of 6 weeks so bought my 2900XT which I am perfectly happy with :)

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24/7 OC...??

CJ

Actually that was the max they reached. They backed it off to 4.2ghz for the benchmarks.

This oc doesn't give you that more mhz at the end, the energy loss is so high, that it isn't really worth to oc that high, though looks great on a picture.

The optimum oc way for the 8400 cpu is around 3.6-3.8 ghz. Still fast enough for the moment.

What are you talking about? The higher you can run stable the better. Check out the benches at the beginning of the thread. 4.2 compared to 3.8 is about 20 fps in quake4 or nearly a 15% performance improvement. An e8400 @4.2 is significantly faster than one at 3.8ghz. Either way I'd be happy. Energy loss? These new cpu's are running 4ghz+ like the conroes ran 3ghz+. They are using less watts at 4.2 than a 90nm AMD x2 uses at 3.2. This new design is a real breakthrough. That's how it's being done on just air coolers.

To answer the other question. Many people are leaving their e8400's at 4ghz+ for a 24/7 overclock on nothing more than a decent aftermarket air cooler.

This is the best overclocking processor to ever hit the home pc market.

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What are you talking about? The higher you can run stable the better. Check out the benches at the beginning of the thread. 4.2 compared to 3.8 is about 20 fps in quake4 or nearly a 15% performance improvement. An e8400 @4.2 is significantly faster than one at 3.8ghz. Either way I'd be happy. Energy loss? These new cpu's are running 4ghz+ like the conroes ran 3ghz+. They are using less watts at 4.2 than a 90nm AMD x2 uses at 3.2. This new design is a real breakthrough. That's how it's being done on just air coolers.

3ghz oc to 3.6ghz energie consumption + 15 watt

3.6 ghz to 4.2 ghz + 50 watt.

You see my point?

And btw. this new core duo isn't a "break thrue" design, the only difference to the former conroe is that its made in 45nm and they put in sse4.1 but nearly no program can make use of this "feature" at the moment.

And... it's also not the best oc CPU ever, like you believe, or show me one were you can 50% oc. without rising up the Vcore. Not even close. From 3ghz to 4ghz thats only 33% and you have to turn up your vcore.

And the benchmark you found on THG was only a comparison between the new Wolfdale and older conroes. That was the only reason why you could'n find any AMD cpu in these benches ;)

Sure, it's faster and the energie consumption is reduced because of the die shrinking, but nothing less I expect from a new CPU.

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It depends vastly on pure luck where your cpu will reach it's limit before needing voltage. Many wolfdales are making it to 4ghz on stock voltage. You may only make it to 3.8 before needing voltage. You can't pick a speed and say that's the usual limit. It varies by 500mhz at least for chip to chip and from different batches at intel plants. Overclocking also is dependent heavily on a mesh of good components not just the cpu alone.

You haven't read about them have you? Nothing new besides the die shrink?... hardly. They fundamentally changed the way the cpu is built. They have an entirely new transistor design with new materials.

http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/10/29/intel_penryn_4ghz_with_air_cooling/

Simultaneously, Intel has also made radical changes to its production process, breaking with the conventional method. Instead of producing MOSFET transistors inside the CPU via the conventional silicon-oxide technique in use since 1960, Intel now fabricates the transistors using a new High-K Dielectric technique. As a result, the Penryn core has improved over the previous CPU generation in several ways.

This is what we can tell you after several nights of burning the midnight oil, grueling tests and experiencing the deficiencies of several components first-hand. The new processors, which are now produced on a 45 nm fabrication process, not only consume phenomenally little energy, they also offer outstanding overclocking potential. Even with the processor overclocked to its limit, its thermal dissipation and power consumption are almost on par with those of today's Core 2 CPUs - at their default settings.

New Dielectric Minimizes Leakage Currents

Since 1960, all MOSFETs - that is, all transistors in today's processors - have been produced using silicon and silicon dioxide exclusively. With the launch of the Penryn processor, and the simultaneous switch to 45 nm technology for its processors, Intel is the first manufacturer to add another material to the production process.

newtransistor.png

In each transistor, Intel has replaced two layers (depicted in blue and yellow here) with a different material. In the yellow layer, which is responsible for the switching ratio between the source and the drain of the MOSFETs, the previously used silicon oxide has been replaced with a high-K dielectric material based on Hafnium (Hf). Additionally, the silicon-gate layer above it (in blue) has been replaced with a metal layer.

Compared to the conventional process, which is still in use for the 65 nm processors, this changes the following characteristics:

* The switching speed of the transistors increases by 20%.

* The leakage current, which is responsible for the high thermal power dissipation (especially of the Pentium 4 Prescott) are reduced by a factor of 10.

Thus, the switching time of the individual transistors in the new Penryn CPU has decreased, and the switching behavior provides clearer signals.

It is thanks to these two new materials that the Penryn CPU has such extraordinary overclocking potential. Even clock speeds of 4 GHz and above no longer pose a problem, as we witnessed at this year's Intel Developer Forum.

The 45 nm production process offers the following advantages over the 65 nm process:

* Almost twice as many transistors can fit onto the same chip area.

* Power consumption is reduced by about 30%.

At the same clock speed, the new Penryn is faster than its 65 nm predecessor Conroe. The two most important innovations, which are directly responsible for this performance boost, are an L2 cache that has grown from 2 x 4 MB to 2 x 6 MB, and the introduction of the new SSE4 instruction set.

As a result of the larger L2 cache, several applications can reduce the number of times they need to access the comparatively slow RAM, allowing them to experience a performance boost of up to 27%.

In case you were wondering a wolfdale is a dual core penryn. Penryn was an early codename.

By best overclocker ever I meant it's hitting higher speeds than ever before, unless you can hit 4.4ghz with your conroe core. The percentage will be higher when the low end 45nm parts come out too. Right now we only have a couple of upper end cpu's. When an e8000 hits the market clocked at 2.3 stock then you'll see the 90% over stock overclocks.

I told you where the top AMD would line up in that chart and that's a pretty generous spot next to the Q6600. What I said is true. They can barely make it on that chart. If you decided to push the clock of any of the cpu's on the low end of the chart they'd run away from the AMD performance wise as well.

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3ghz oc to 3.6ghz energie consumption + 15 watt

3.6 ghz to 4.2 ghz + 50 watt.

You see my point?

Yeah, but nobody cares about upping the voltage since the CPU is more than capable of handling higher voltages; as long as you have sufficient cooling, why should you care? Are you worried about your energy bill?

I've been running my first generation E6400 at 1.4v for over a year now with no problems whatsoever.

And btw. this new core duo isn't a "break thrue" design, the only difference to the former conroe is that its made in 45nm and they put in sse4.1 but nearly no program can make use of this "feature" at the moment.

It's a more efficient design in terms of performance and has more slightly more operations per clock.

Benchmarks have shown that even at identical speeds, the Wolfdales out-perform the Conroes.

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Well it's completely up to you whether or not you think the benefits of Raptor harddrives are worth it. I really couldn't justify the money for performance gained. How much are they going for these days anyway? Last I looked it was over $200 a drive. The same money could get you a 1TB WD drive. Roughly 176 give or take the day they are being sold.

If i were going for storage i would go your route, but im more concerned with speed but not to the point to go SCSI. Not to mention i like my baby raptors i have now.

Buying four of them just seems like a little bit of overkill unless you have cash falling out of your pockets. Nope, i buy this stuff in parts so two here two there or one, one, one, one you get the idea.

I can see where you're coming from with the 8GB of RAM. Thank You. I don't think any game will use over 2GB for a while Me either. but I bought another 2GB and now have 4 myself just because it was so cheap. Exactly My thinking So why not max it out while i can. Didn't notice a single bit of performance gain but it's nice to know that side of things won't need an upgrade for a while. Yeah, i didn't notice a real big boost with my present system, does seem smoother thou.

And I'm not the kind of person that upgrades every few months either. Stuck with my craptastic dell for 3 years before I realised the joy of custom building. Since then I've had the same CPU and case, RAM got an upgrade from the dell stuff, had two motherboards. Graphics are another matter as I bought a 7600GT AGP, sold that and bought a 7900GS PCI-E second hand for a massive £10 but managed to break it in the space of 6 weeks so bought my 2900XT which I am perfectly happy with :)

This last part is what i normally do as well, but when AMD did their little move to suck money out of us with the 940 pin change and was force into an entire upgrade just to keep pace i held off til i felt it was worth the cash to do my upgrade. Then vista came out and pushed it a little farther.

Honestly, i would still be holding off til Nehalem comes out at the end of year. But i'm having a problem with my motherboard as of late thats kinda forcing my hand into this upgrade.

I was gonna go the whole hog with DDR3 and the latest extreme edition until i got to reading up on that new CPU and thought, why bother since that means a whole new board will be coming in as well, which will make that entire expense worthless in less than a year and ill be caught right where i am now.

So what i am building now is a secondary system that will tie the kids and wife over for a bit and won't cost me an arm to upgrade later as the prices drop on these latest CPU's and video cards.

Now next June? I maybe in overkill mode for the main system, will have to see when we get there.

Sorry for the slow response, but im gone thru the week.

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I tried to assimilate the info provided in this post and am trying to get system ordered this weekend.

Can you take a look at these and offer insight or opinons?

I am confused about... sound card.......wireless card

CAS: NEW!!! CoolerMaster Cosmos S Gaming Full Tower 420W Case w/ See-Thru Side Panel (Original Color)

CS_FAN: Default case fans

CPU: (Sckt775)Intel® Core™ 2 Duo E8400 @ 3.0GHz 1333FSB 6MB L2 Cache 64-bit [-70]

CD: Sony 20X Double Layer Dual Format DVD+-R/+-RW + CD-R/RW Drive [+4] (BLACK COLOR)

CD2: SONY 16X DVD-ROM [+4] (BLACK COLOR)

FLASHMEDIA: INTERNAL 12in1 Flash Media Reader/Writer (BLACK COLOR)

FAN: INTEL LGA775 CERTIFIED CPU FAN & HEATSINK

FREEBIE_OS: FREE! (Halo 2) Game

HDD: Single Hard Drive (150GB Gaming Western Digital Rapter 10,000RPM SATA150 16MB Cache WD1500ADFD [+104])

MOTHERBOARD: (QX9650 Support) Asus P5N-D nForce 750i SLI Chipset LGA775 FSB1333 DDR2 Mainboard

MEMORY: (Req.DDR2 MainBoard)2GB (2x1GB) PC6400 DDR2/800 Dual Channel Memory (Corsair XMS2 Xtreme Memory w/ Heat Spreader [+50])

NETWORK: Killer K1 10/100/1000 Gigabit High Speed Online Gaming PCI Network Interface Card [+179]

OS: Microsoft® Windows Vista™ Home Premium w/ Service Pack 1 (64-bit Edition [+19])

POWERSUPPLY: 635 Watts Power Supplies [+10] (($30 off Mail-in Rebate) Sigma Shark SP-635W PSU - SLI Ready)

SOFT: Free 60 Days Microsoft® Office® 2007 (Words, Excel, Access, Power Point, Outlook + More) - Windows Vista™ Required

SOUND: Creative Labs X-Fi 24-BIT PCI Sound Card [+79]

SPEAKERS: NONE [-72]

USB: Built-in USB 2.0 Ports

VIDEO: NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GT 512MB 16X PCI Express (EVGA Powered by NVIDIA [+5])

WAP: Zonet USB Wireless 802.11g 54Mbps Network Adapter

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It looks good. Personally I'd go with an intel x38 chipset MB over the nvidia 750i. Intel chipsets are better overclockers but that's just me. I like to push my chips. You might not.

With an intel chipset MB you can't run dual nvidia cards so if you're planning on SLI best to stick with an nvidia chipset MB anyway.

I like this MB myself if I was building tomorrow.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813127033

I suspect this is a prebuilt system and you don't have the option to change the parts. If you did the price on the 8800gts 512meg has dropped to within 20-30 dollars of the 8800gt. The GTS 512 is a good 10-15% faster for a minimal additional amount of money.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127325

This is the best deal in gaming cards at the moment. It's a little higher clock speed than the 8800gt and it has more stream processors. At $199 after mail in rebate it's pratically the same price as the 8800gt.

I like that I see an 8000 series intel on your list. Those are awesome cpu's. The best for gaming you can buy right now. I would like to see an aftermarket cooler. The stock ones leave so much to be desired. On the other hand it's not a particularly hot running cpu.

Here's a good but cheap aftermarket cooler if you have the option.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186134

All in all what they put together is a damn good system. I can nit pick at it but they did pretty well. What's the final price on that? Is that just the tower or does it include monitor, keyboard, and such?

If you're more worried about how much hard drive space you have then being split seconds faster at accessing files, I'd drop the raptor hard drive and go with a 500gig 7200rpm model. The 10,000rpm hard drives are fast but they are noisy and fail at a much higher rate than their slightly slower counterparts. Every review on a 10,000 rpm drive I've read about the first thing they mention is how noisy they are.

If you want the speed of a raptor but you don't want to be limited with the smaller capacities and higher prices they offer get yourself 2 identical hard drives and run a raid0 array. A raid0 puts half your info on 1 drive and half on the other. It always accesses both at the same time giving you more bandwidth and it would probably outperform a single raptor. Also in a raid0 you get to add the capacity of the two drives together so 2 cheap 250gig hard drives make 1 fast 500gig that is recognized and functions as a single drive.

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Lazyboy: Thanks for the input. I do have options to change out and they do have the cooler you mentioned so I will make that change also. 8800GTS is $70 USD more than the 8800GT 1G. I will probably do it.

These are the choices they give me for MB.

EVGA nForce 780i SLI Mainboard FSB1333 DDR2 3 x PCIe x16 SATA RAID w/ USB2.0,IEEE1394,&7.1Audio

Asus P5N-T Deluxe nForce 780i SLI Mainboard FSB1333 DDR2 3 x PCIe x16 SATA RAID w/ USB2.0,IEEE1394,&7.1Audio((3-Way SLI & QX9650 Support) Asus P5N-T Deluxe nForce 780i SLI Mainboard FSB1333 DDR2 3 x PCIe x16 SATA RAID w/ USB2.0,IEEE1394,&7.1Audio)

Asus Striker II Formula nForce 780i SLI Mainboard FSB1333 DDR2 3 x PCIe X16 SATA RAID w/ USB2.0,IEEE1394,&7.1Audio

RAID 0 choice is:

EVGA nForce 780i SLI Mainboard FSB1333 DDR2 3 x PCIe x16 SATA RAID w/ USB2.0,IEEE1394,&7.1Audio ( I don't treat anything different do I for this RAID thing? I am not a computer guy)

The system prices about $1,600 incl s/h with a no hassle 3 yr warranty. I priced out the specs at newegg and am paying about $200 for them to put it together and the warranty.

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Those MB's options aren't all that different from each other. They're all the same chipset. Is one more expensive than the rest? I think I'd take the EVGA. I've never been an Asus fan. Read the reviews on their nvidia 780i boards at newegg. There's a few horror stories. Average rating was 2 eggs out of 5 last I checked with quite a few reviews.

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The top end Asus boards do ok in the reviews but the P5N-T deluxe seems to have some issues.

The EVGA 780i boards are 5 eggs in contrast and one is a recent customer satisfaction award winner at newegg.

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my equip is so totally out of date that i have little idea on current systems and requirements

so a few questions,

power supplies is an Antec EarthWatts EA-500 500W ps ok for an e8400+8800gts+sb xfi sound card+2mgs ram, and all the other equip....

(psu in the case deal - antec sonata III)http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Antec/Sonata_III/4.html

the gpu seems to want a 28A (?) supply for itself...(425W PCI Express-compliant system power supply with a combined 12V current rating of 28A or more (Minimum system power requirement based on a standard PC configured with an Intel® Core™2 Extreme X6800 processor)

or is the gpus pwr reqments additive?

v1(17A)+v2(17A)=34A total

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i have run Asus/Amd combo for around 5 years, im in love with AMD and now Asus also.

AMD Athlon 64 3400+ (single core)

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Yeah' date=' but nobody cares about upping the voltage since the CPU is more than capable of handling higher voltages; as long as you have sufficient cooling, why should you care? Are you worried about your energy bill?[/quote']

The above example doesn't work without upping the voltage. And it's not a question, in first place, about cooling the CPU.

Yes, as a former Clerk Im looking at my bills, and I'm not willing to pay for 10% speed increase 50% more for the energie it needs. And btw. I'm more worried about my weekly gas/petrol bills.... nah... it's a hobby too ;)

I've been running my first generation E6400 at 1.4v for over a year now with no problems whatsoever.

My 6300 runs at 1.25, and you didn't upped your voltage - your sure?

Benchmarks have shown that even at identical speeds, the Wolfdales out-perform the Conroes.

No wonder with more 2. level cache.

Maybe some do misunderstand me, I'm not against overclocking, my first oc attempt was with a P75 up to 90mhz, also I support the new Intel series, but you can't tell casual PC users to oc, turn on some switches, and it's ok.

The hottest elements in my System are already my MB and I don't want to know at how my RAM runs. The 4.4 ghz example I wouldn't try without a water cooled MB.... and there it goes your money. Really, the CPU isn't the biggest problem.

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The above example doesn't work without upping the voltage. And it's not a question, in first place, about cooling the CPU.

Yes, as a former Clerk Im looking at my bills, and I'm not willing to pay for 10% speed increase 50% more for the energie it needs. And btw. I'm more worried about my weekly gas/petrol bills.... nah... it's a hobby too ;)

My 6300 runs at 1.25, and you didn't upped your voltage - your sure?

No wonder with more 2. level cache.

Maybe some do misunderstand me, I'm not against overclocking, my first oc attempt was with a P75 up to 90mhz, also I support the new Intel series, but you can't tell casual PC users to oc, turn on some switches, and it's ok.

The hottest elements in my System are already my MB and I don't want to know at how my RAM runs. The 4.4 ghz example I wouldn't try without a water cooled MB.... and there it goes your money. Really, the CPU isn't the biggest problem.

Actually you can get closer to a 25-50% speed increase from most core2duo's but stay in denial if you like. We'll all run circles around your fps numbers with our overclocked cpus.

One of the last e8400 builds in these forums is running 4.2ghz on air cool and stable 24/7. People who refuse to overclock will have to wait a year or more before those kinds of speeds are even available in stores much less affordable.

Things change as tech moves forward and what was unreachable clock speeds a short time ago is easily attainable now. You're worried about how much more your cpu will burn in electricity when it's overclocked?.. lol. It's about half as much additional electricy use as turning one extra 100watt light bulb on in your house, probably less. Max output on the highest end extreme models was about 125watts, an increase of about 75watts over a low end cpu. These numbers are before 45nm cpu's came out and reduced the power draw even further. If you're worried about that low of an addition to your electric bill what are you doing with a cutting edge PC? They're too expensive. They lose half their value in 6 months to a year.

He didn't say he didn't up the voltage. He said that he's been running with increased voltage for years and it hasn't effected anything.

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my equip is so totally out of date that i have little idea on current systems and requirements

so a few questions,

power supplies is an Antec EarthWatts EA-500 500W ps ok for an e8400+8800gts+sb xfi sound card+2mgs ram, and all the other equip....

(psu in the case deal - antec sonata III)http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Antec/Sonata_III/4.html

the gpu seems to want a 28A (?) supply for itself...(425W PCI Express-compliant system power supply with a combined 12V current rating of 28A or more (Minimum system power requirement based on a standard PC configured with an Intel® Core™2 Extreme X6800 processor)

or is the gpus pwr reqments additive?

v1(17A)+v2(17A)=34A total

You can add the totals together. I see this funny phenomenon lately. Video cards specify what total 12volt amp rating they want and PSU manufacturers only give specs on the individual plugs.

I had a friend that spent over $250 on a PSU that would run 30 amps on each 12volt rail because his ATI x1900xt AIW recommended a 30 amp PSU. I run the same card with an 18amp rated PSU. ATI was talking about total amps not a single plug rating. They will continue to let people get fooled into buying huge PSU's. It's a win win for the computer industry.

The new corsair tx series is selling PSU's with a 12volt video card plug getting the full rating. The 750watt version has a 60 amp 12volt rail and is only about $130.

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The above example doesn't work without upping the voltage. And it's not a question, in first place, about cooling the CPU.

Yes, as a former Clerk Im looking at my bills, and I'm not willing to pay for 10% speed increase 50% more for the energie it needs. And btw. I'm more worried about my weekly gas/petrol bills.... nah... it's a hobby too ;)

You don't need a 50% increase in voltage for a 10% speed increase.

In fact, the Core 2 Duos cannot withstand an increase of 50% in voltage; it will likely damage the CPU, probably overloading it, even if you had the ability to cool it. Some hardcore enthusiasts could probably do it....but I have no idea how without damaging the CPU.

The increases in CPU voltage used when overclocking to achieve stability are so minor that they're unlikely to do anything beyond add fractions of pennies to your energy bill, and even then only if you left your computer on all day and night.

My 6300 runs at 1.25, and you didn't upped your voltage - your sure?

Never said I didn't up the voltage, though significant overclocking on all Core 2 Duos is easy if not standard without any voltage increase.

My E6400's stock voltage is 1.325v; its stock speed is 2.14ghz. It's running right now at 3.1ghz (a 50% increase in speed!) with the voltage upped to 1.4v (that's an increase of 0.075 volts).

1.4v is considered "high" for Core 2 Duos and higher voltages than this are not necessarily needed (though some brave or foolish overclockers go to 1.5+). The "real" voltage is actually lower than this (due to something called "VDroop"), likely 1.38v or so.

The 1.25v being reported for your CPU is not its stock operating voltage; it's actually 1.325 like mine. 1.25v is the voltage set by the C1E "power saving" feature in conjunction with "Enhanced SpeedStep"; these features downclock and lower the voltage of your CPU dynamically when it's not under heavy load.

Many people report being able to hit 3ghz @ stock voltage with the E6300 and have had it running there ever since the E6300 came out. The "luck" in OCing is that some people are more successful than others, and a wide range of factors are involved. I've never heard one case of an OC'ed E6300 dying.

No wonder with more 2. level cache.

True, the cache size helps but it's not the cache alone.

The Wolfdale has more efficient architecture on a smaller die size in addition to the extra cache.

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