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miketh2005

New Player Here, Trying To Wrap My Head Around This Game...

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I swear this is all a prank. I'm being pranked by my friends, I swear this game is not real. I can't wrap my head around this concept, if what my friend told me about this is true. He says this is just like real life war, where you spend 8 hours to kill 3-4 guys. Mostly just waiting around doing nothing. Nothing. Isn't that boring? I don't understand this. A game is supposed to be fun, the more fun, the better. Not boring, not waiting, not doing nothing. Not guarding a door for 8 hours.

I'm literally crying from the horror this guy is telling me about this game, and I never cry at all, because I don't allow things bother me. My girlfriend breaks up with me after 3 years, I'm a little distraught, but I continue on a day later, I don't cry. But this is different. It defys all logic. Why? Because as a game designer, I've spent most of my life understanding how things work, what people what, what makes things fun. This game... This game shoves everything I've learned and shoves it up my ***. This is beyond all human nature, this game. I can't understand it....

The realism? Okay, I can understand to a certain degree, why people would like realism. But NOT, just NOT when it makes a game boring. People like satisfaction, it's what makes games, games. The satisfaction of accomplishing something. My friend told me, he'd spend a whole day fighting to capture a bunker and the next day it'd be taken over again. That's not satisfaction. It's a freakin game, guys! A game! It shouldn't require endless devotion like this guy is telling me about. I just dont understand it. Please try to explain yourselves to me, it will help me sleep better at night. I doubt I will ever be able to sleep again without knowing what makes people do this. Please tell me.

Thanks.

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It's not, the game has realistic weapon modeling, that means such things as you can look at documents from world war 2 telling you how well a certain munition works and directly apply it to if you can kill a tank in game with it. It is also bigger, and a more strategic game than any shoebox shooter, but it's hardly a realistic war simulator.

The game is free to try so why don't you sign up and see if you like it.

And of course you can loose a bunker, just as easily as you can capture it, there are two sides you know. :)

Edited by Fredrik1

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It's not, the game has realistic weapon modeling, that means such things as you can look at documents from world war 2 telling you how well a certain munition works and directly apply it to if you can kill a tank in game with it. It is also bigger, and a more strategic game than any shoebox shooter, but it's hardly a realistic war simulator.

The game is free to try so why don't you sign up and see if you like it.

And of course you can loose a bunker, just as easily as you can capture it, there are two sides you know. :)

But what about the 8 hours guarding a door thing?

I tried playing, but the specs are way too high. It's such an old game, but requires so much!!! People in 1999 didn't have that sort of system! And even if they added a few graphical upgrades, it should've been able to be turned off / down. I turned all the settings off / low and still getting choppy FPS. :/

My system has 2.0 GHZ processor, 2GB RAM, 128 MB graphics card. Can run GTASA, but can't run a game that's 6 years older... crazy. The graphics aren't even good. Why does it need so much power? Seems to me like the developers aren't optimizing it properly.

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But do you watch guarding the same spot for 8 hours straight? And it takes 30 minutes in transit to a bunker in a tank? That's boring. :/ Why do that?

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You do whatever pleases you in this game, I've never been on a mission where I'd have to guard a thing for 8 straight hours. And if a FB/Spawnable needs guarding you could start a rotation with your squadmates. (I do alot of FB guarding/attack missions.)

If you're having problem finding action in this game give me a tell and I'll help you out!

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Okay, just a FYI, no one spends 8 hours gaurding a door.

And the reason why it takes such high specs is because it loads the entire map (which is massive) in one go, like ALL AT ONCE, thats alot of map to load, at no point in game when you are on the ground shooting at people, then you decide to move forward a bit then a loading screen pops up. It's all in one, that requires a good compute to run.

ps, the game is 10 years old, not 6........

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You got about everything wrong mate. These days no one ever guards something for eight hours. You can find action in 30 seconds and be killing people in no time.

Now i am not sure what you mean by a few updates, but i can find you some day one screen shots and screen shots from today, it will seem like two different games. Now i don't know if the game is optimized, but most people have computers witch can run the game.

You claim to be a game designer, but you have a computer witch is not up to speed by 2011 standard. What kinda games do you work on, Farmwill?

I read your first post and I read everything that is wrong with games today. Most games are all about easy and generic tasks witch has not changed since i started playing in the mid 90s. Most games these days are to easy, you get everything for nothing, in my mind that is not fun. I want to be challenged when i play and this game delivers on that front. I will admit it is not fun losing something you have worked hard to keep, but it is oh so much sweeter when you pull of something difficult.

You see teamwork in this game, you see your actions affect the game world and no two battles are alike. Not many games can stay the same. Then of course you can talk about the people playing the game, in all my years as a gamer i have played many online games and this is by far the one with the nicest and most fun players.

What you can or can not understand is limited by you as a person and to be honest that seems like a big limit at the moment, but this game has survived for 10 years and it is fun to play, maybe that is something to keep in mind when you are working on your next flash game.

You understand?

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I don't know where you heard you have to wait 8 hours guarding a door or takes an hour to drive a tank to a bunker.

Get yourself some hardware and try the game out. Join a squad and you will see what we are talking about.

While this game is "6 years older" like you said it is constantly going thru graphics and scalability upgrades. It runs OK on decent hardware. I havent updated my hardware in over 2 years and I get great framerates.

Not really sure what your purpose is here. Try the game and find out what its like. Otherwise I would have to think that you are just here to troll and that's why youre not getting any responses.

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No, you don't have to watch a door for 8 hours. I mean, you could if you chose to, but you absolutely don't have to.

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Not everyone gets the thrill out of headless zoombie killing, ok sometimes maybe.. :D

But sometimes its nice to sit and relax with a game, this game offers relaxing atmosphere and laughing guys on ts or the more serious guys trying to use different tactics.

Either way, people are different :D

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But do you watch guarding the same spot for 8 hours straight? And it takes 30 minutes in transit to a bunker in a tank? That's boring. :/ Why do that?

That is really NOT what happens in this game. Usual players may stay in one town for hours, if that town is under attack. And an attack may last for more than 8 hours, with players entering and leaving (this is a mmo with a persistent world).

A tank can driven from a spawn point to an attack objective in 5 minutes (? wild guess ?). Good tankers may take longer since if you only drive straight to your enemy, you will be killed.

This is not a game from 2000 or even from 2006. The engine is always evolving and so are the minimum specs (any recent medium-low "game" video card will allow you to play this game).

We do have some aspects of the game that may seem a bit boring: caping a cp for 8 min (it's like capturing a flag) or defending it for 20 minutes (without ever seeing an enemy) is in fact boring for a game :D .

But you don't have to do this. You can always spawn near the action and kill kill kill.

When you get a new pc, try it. And I promise you this: You'll either love it or hate it ;)

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But do you watch guarding the same spot for 8 hours straight? And it takes 30 minutes in transit to a bunker in a tank? That's boring. :/ Why do that?

noone sits in a door for 8hours exept for some nuts.. an attack usually stays for 3-5hours then its usually decided by HC if the attack should keep on it or leave if they are losing to much supply.

and pretty much everyone go out in the field trying to kill each others.

myself i spend most my time in a plane strafing incoming trucks, different kind of guns and infantrys :D

or playing as AA, shooting down incoming bombers or helping our pilots fighting the LW fighters that is competing about the airspace above the town.

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But what about the 8 hours guarding a door thing?

I tried playing, but the specs are way too high. It's such an old game, but requires so much!!! People in 1999 didn't have that sort of system! And even if they added a few graphical upgrades, it should've been able to be turned off / down. I turned all the settings off / low and still getting choppy FPS. :/

My system has 2.0 GHZ processor, 2GB RAM, 128 MB graphics card. Can run GTASA, but can't run a game that's 6 years older... crazy. The graphics aren't even good. Why does it need so much power? Seems to me like the developers aren't optimizing it properly.

The game began in 1999, as computers have advanced so has the game. I began playing this on a k7 500mhz with a voodoo 3/4 vid with 32megs ram.

But that was over 10 years ago. This game is a ongoing evolution where shaders required etc advances as the technoligy does.

As to guarding, its a preferance. You can guard and kill the enemy as they come to you (and recieve guard points in the process) or go out and hunt them.

Find a good spot to snipe or run around getting shot. I have well over 30k kills over a 10 year period so 2 to 3 kills per 8 hours does'nt quite add up to that :)

The game is about capture, defence, stats. About folks who use stratigy to win and folks who just play to have a good time. There is pretty much something to satisify any type of game play. You can lone wolf or join a squad and be part of a team. Join HC and have a hand in the upperlevel decisions of brigade movement etc or be non HC and simply roam from fight to fight.

You take a town your side owns it. If the other side wants it back they gota take it back. But it's a 24/7 game so what you took today may well be lost while you sleep, or more gains may take place in that time period. It's not scripted, a campaign runs until one side owns pretty much all of the game world. Your side can get pushed to one small corner and still it's possible to breakout and push the other side across the map. It happens on occasion too.

What happens depends on HC decisions, the players actions and the consquences of both.

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The times you mention are not consistent with what players experience. No one is required to guard something for 30 minutes .... or even guard at all. Play how you want to play. Though you can engage in slower, lower intensity areas of the game, there is always a couple focused action areas where the action is high intensity. Also if you are guarding a capture point in a contested area ...you won't be just standing there ... :)

Relative to armor .... it may take 5 minutes to drive from a forward base to a town you are attacking .... but what stands between you in the town is an unknown. Has the enemy deployed a few antitank guns out there? Is there enemy infantry roaming the fields and forest you are traveling through? The battle occurs over a wide area.

Anyway as others have said, you have to try it to see if its for you. Its generally not for twitch gamers and is more like playing an FPS with a realism mod that slows things down and uses a more a realistic damage model .... like if you are infantry and get shot by a bullet you are dead.

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But do you watch guarding the same spot for 8 hours straight? And it takes 30 minutes in transit to a bunker in a tank? That's boring. :/ Why do that?

No basically you are guarding a building with 2 entrances and a top floor.. so u can run around in it if u want ;)

yes well boring to you.. fun for others.... i mean for some its boring to spwn run for a flag to capture it and getting killed within the min.. then to do it all over again.... or for some its boring that if u play a game again you do te path over and over so you know where the enemies will pop up.. in this game no "round" is the same... and no other game is as big as this game as it comes to mapsize without loading screens in between... :cool:

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I almost want to say troll.

But really, a part of the reason the game uses so much power because of all the calculations it's running in the background. Instead of "shot X does Y damage" it goes "shot X and X1 velocity, impacting at X2 angle, with blah blah blah blah blah (other factors) determines what happens."

The map is also enormous and is entirely without zones. Check this out:

http://www.mmo-symposium.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/mmogmaps_001.jpg

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What makes te game "boring" is lack of numbers playing, either in an attack or on the entire map period. The limits on available weapons, limited by either rank or tier, further de-funs the game. Lastly side imbalance, lack of cooperation, lack of comms, also makes even vets leave.

But when you have those times when the game is filled and your one of 40 vehicles rolling toward a town, air power passing you overhead in support, ATGs and Frus being placed expertly, paras jumping in a diversion attack ? Everyone on the same page and communicating ? AND you come up against an equal number, equaly skilled, enemy determined to hold their town at all costs ? With Hundreds of combatants doing whatever they have to do to support their side ?

Brother THAT is the real thing! That is the fun. Heck Ive had fun just driving support trucks all night long. To me coming to the aid of others IS the fun.

The first year of my BGE career just had me engrossed. If we kept the same crowd I never would have left. I have never seen a game with that level of teamwork we had here years ago. This has always been a game that attracted older players I think. More team orientated

I swear this is all a prank. I'm being pranked by my friends, I swear this game is not real. I can't wrap my head around this concept, if what my friend told me about this is true. He says this is just like real life war, where you spend 8 hours to kill 3-4 guys. Mostly just waiting around doing nothing. Nothing. Isn't that boring? I don't understand this. A game is supposed to be fun, the more fun, the better. Not boring, not waiting, not doing nothing. Not guarding a door for 8 hours.

I'm literally crying from the horror this guy is telling me about this game, and I never cry at all, because I don't allow things bother me. My girlfriend breaks up with me after 3 years, I'm a little distraught, but I continue on a day later, I don't cry. But this is different. It defys all logic. Why? Because as a game designer, I've spent most of my life understanding how things work, what people what, what makes things fun. This game... This game shoves everything I've learned and shoves it up my ***. This is beyond all human nature, this game. I can't understand it....

The realism? Okay, I can understand to a certain degree, why people would like realism. But NOT, just NOT when it makes a game boring. People like satisfaction, it's what makes games, games. The satisfaction of accomplishing something. My friend told me, he'd spend a whole day fighting to capture a bunker and the next day it'd be taken over again. That's not satisfaction. It's a freakin game, guys! A game! It shouldn't require endless devotion like this guy is telling me about. I just dont understand it. Please try to explain yourselves to me, it will help me sleep better at night. I doubt I will ever be able to sleep again without knowing what makes people do this. Please tell me.

Thanks.

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I dont know about you guys but whenever I play this game, it certainly isn't laid back. WWIIONLINE is more than capable of being the 'COD' shooter, you just have to know where to be and when to be there, period.

And this whole forum is a perfect example of why I love WWIIONLINE so much. You actually have to be "smart" and have a "brain" in order to get kills. Not just an itchy trigger finger.

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currently as infantry you will not always find an intense fight. you have to know when to despawn or just log out, some fights are not worth the time for an infantry, but when you do see a massive battle you will understand why we endure the downtimes, some battles are very epic in between the downtimes. some fights you'r better off pulling a AA and trying to shoot down aircraft, some fights are geared for infantry, and then you get a battle where everything is happening in every direction, those fights are very impressive

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I'm a game designer (Flash games - but it is nothing wrong with it, there is a lot of cool flash games), but I can see why this game is grand. It is precisely because it is not FUN the way other pop games are. I know most people would see chess as boring game, but for me it is FUN. I played this game yesterday for the first time and I loved it. It is demanding, annoying and extremely hard, but I was extremely proud of myself when after 5 hours playing it I had 2 kills/40 deaths (and destroyed one AA as well). It is really cool when you jump into the plane with other paras and give your live away into hands of not quite experienced pilot who have to dodge AA fire and enemy fighters to get you to the drop point. It is like a Dwarven Fortress - sometimes losing is FUN (as long as you give a fair fight).

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Well, here are a few thoughts from a newb, soon to wrap up my 14 day trial here. I have played both sides a bit, though mainly allied, and have been involved with several different types of infantry operations as well as a couple of paratrooper drops. I have also done antitank gun and antiaircraft gun work. No piloting, armored, or naval stuff yet.

One might want to be careful taking me under the wing! I have accidentally shot a few people on my own side. After a misidentification of a German ATG while playing as a French one (I shot at him when I realized, but missed twice at close range.. the horror!) I got too trigger happy for my own good. Not to mention that whole thing with grenades bouncing off walls. I would like to apologize to the couple people I accidentally shot!

The reason I made these errors is that sometimes when characters are partly hidden or partly visible I don’t see their names pop up if they are friendlies, fortunately experience fixed this by now, as I can recognize different uniforms and gear better. The problem with the Axis ATG was, I saw him sitting in the bushes pointed the other way as a mass Allied invasion was rolling out, and was wondering “where’s his name” until I got close and saw the crew had German outfits! Oops! Totally newb mistake, to be sure, and again sorry to the others on my side I accidentally shot or shot at in later missions! I’m not a spy, my target recognition was just really horrible there for a while!

However, once when I played Axis I saw a couple guys repeatedly shooting each other at point blank range to goof around and the weapons had no effect on their characters. Are only Allied characters vulnerable to “friendly fire?” Just a question I had.

OK, onto my suggestions. The difficulty of training in Battleground Europe, from my limited experience, is that the fluidity and pace of the game mean you can be doing different types of missions in a very short time frame. That is great for action and varying the experience but makes training tough. One mission may find you sneaking through a vast area of woods and fields, the next you may be in a house to house battle. You may be manning an antitank gun one time, unsure of what the mission is or why it is being sent out, and the next parachuting out of a transport. These missions can vary from minute to minute. You also can vary in your gear and setup depending on side, and in the case of the Allies, you may be using French equipment one mission and British the next. Again, experience builds in time. The first few days are easily the toughest part of the curve. It helps for newbies if there is a good organization and plan to the mission. Of course this also varies, not just due to leadership but due again to the fluidity of the game, things that come out of the blue mean less time for chat and planning, if you have to respond and right now as a side, there may not be time. It is a lot of stuff and it varies minute to minute.

So, I was wondering if “Newbie Squads” might be one possible answer. Think of it this way. They could be organized by side, newbies invited to temporarily join. There would be experienced players who would volunteer, possibly on rotating duty from a volunteer pool, to be the experienced “Sergeants” or “Officers” for the raw recruits. They could be liasons between newbs and the high command, or guides before spawning into a mission, giving pointers as to objectives, approach tactics, etc. to the players in their pool. The only drawback is that newbies could be massed under this system, though they could still be split off to different operations as needed or desired. The main thing would be to see if the newbies could get more detailed mission briefings, etc. before logging in, as many green players probably have a first day of log in, spawn, die, respawn at camped spawn point, die, respawn again, die, get discouraged.

Newbies might be members of the newbie squads for either the 14 days of their trial period or the first month. Also, experienced squad players who volunteer as “officers” or “sergeants” might find a benefit by leading with a good example during their hitch on newbie DI duty, as new players who stick around might want to join their squads later on in the game. The policies on squad recruiting with Newbies would be interesting but probably not a problem, with newbies free to apply to a squad, or not do so, upon completing their time in the newbie squads. Newbies would of course be free to play either side or go back and forth as they choose while in training, same as now. The newbies could still go indie on missions as they wish but the format would be a good way to build understanding of the game system, tactics in the field, and combined operations. It might not be everything they need to know, just basic pointers and a reinforcement of the sense they are part of a team effort. A newbie might wonder “Why do they want me to keep flooding this area if I get killed all the time?” Not only tips on how to hide better or speed in as needed, but a reinforcement of why the operation is underway. Something like: “We are taking this point so we need all possible people out there. If Joe Axis is busy shooting at you he might not see some other guy who makes it into the HQ,” etc. etc. and most importantly, the reinforcement of the sense of team mission in the new player. Newbie instinct is to go solo, which can work sometimes and which almost did for me a few times early, except that I made some very “newbie” tactical errors. (Once I saw “target” on screen as I launched on a one ATG patrol. I returned to base following that arrow, returned to the spawn zone and was killed. Now I know target means objective or area, not where a bad guy is. Yes that was my first day, as I recall.) However newbie squads might help by bringing them more into the fold of the various sides. Also if the player feels their actions are having no impact or that they are being a drawback to their side it can kill morale. (I admit I first tried playing Axis after an early all-Allied run of missions because I felt I was a danger to Allied players and the Allied cause when I played on the Allied side anyway. Ironically, I had shaken a lot of the early bugs out by that time so it wasn’t that bad after that point when I played either side and soon scored my first victories, playing Axis. I swear I was not a spy! I shot some Axis while playing French soon after.)

For what it is worth, my experience on first person shooters took a while to come back. The last first person shooter I played a lot was years ago, the original Quake. The only player vs. player shooter game I had played was called “Marathon” and was many, many moons ago! It did come back after a while though. I have to praise this game in several areas. First, the designers have balanced the game very well, while keeping the realism of the equipment. The emphasis is on line of sight warfare, whatever platform the player is using. All platforms have strengths and weaknesses. The sight picture in the infantry firearms is very true to real life in firearms. Lose sight of the front sight, expect to miss. Miss, and expect that the other player won’t. Also I reset the control sensitivity after my first few days to correct my sighting a bit and that helped end my early string of misses. Much like Massad Ayoob’s “Stress Fire” writ into a game, the effects of stress on aim and target ID are real in BGE, and not just due to the green stamina bar. If you are slewing all over, reset your sensitivity a bit the other way. If you can’t move the weapon fast enough, reset a little the other way. This is very important and may take a while to get “right.”

It is a historical game as well as a brutal first person shooter. At worst, this could mean some people from either background might become discouraged but at the best they will get into the game regardless of background details that helped to bring them here and discover what a fun fusion it is.

Anyway there are some of my observations, hope there some things scattered around in there that could be of use.

One final observation, I would recommend all new players or prospective players to visit the “WillyTee” site. There was actually a lot of strategy stuff there. Hiding in bushes works, as one of his cartoons shows pretty humorously. Yes, an Opel will tow you pretty fast, so I see where some of the “Opel rocket” stuff came from. Yes, you must fear AI, at least ones that don’t disappear when killed so you are still shooting them when the other player driven baddie is coming from the other direction. However I am still looking for all the gorgeous women that are supposed to be out there. And where are the sheep? I was hoping to use them for camouflage or at least as a rifle rest. Even stampede them at the enemy a la the movie "Zulu." Oh well, I am still having a blast. Except for the getting run over by a Stug thing. Heh!

Wow, that went on a bit huh?

David “Ecolier” Powell

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I also am a newbie, and I can't figure it out. I can't get through training because the f keys don't do what they're supposed to do, it's terribly choppy, and no one seems willing to help. I love WWII games, and was really looking forward to joining this community and having some fun. While the rest of the family plays WoW, I planned on immersing myself in WWII online. But I will be deleting the game after my 14 day trial. It is impossible to learn quick enough to get any enjoyment out of it. I'm sure those of you that have been playing for 10 years are having a blast, and I wish I could join you. But this game has me so frustrated I'm about to throw my computer through the window!

Thanks for nothing!!

A VERY disappointed customer

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I also am a newbie, and I can't figure it out. I can't get through training because the f keys don't do what they're supposed to do, it's terribly choppy, and no one seems willing to help. I love WWII games, and was really looking forward to joining this community and having some fun. While the rest of the family plays WoW, I planned on immersing myself in WWII online. But I will be deleting the game after my 14 day trial. It is impossible to learn quick enough to get any enjoyment out of it. I'm sure those of you that have been playing for 10 years are having a blast, and I wish I could join you. But this game has me so frustrated I'm about to throw my computer through the window!

Thanks for nothing!!

A VERY disappointed customer

This game is addicting because it's hard.

There's no easy way to learn this game.

People will help if you take the time to learn how to use the comms.

Or ask questions on the forums.

Good Luck!

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I swear this is all a prank. I'm being pranked by my friends, I swear this game is not real. I can't wrap my head around this concept, if what my friend told me about this is true. He says this is just like real life war, where you spend 8 hours to kill 3-4 guys. Mostly just waiting around doing nothing. Nothing. Isn't that boring? I don't understand this. A game is supposed to be fun, the more fun, the better. Not boring, not waiting, not doing nothing. Not guarding a door for 8 hours.

I'm literally crying from the horror this guy is telling me about this game, and I never cry at all, because I don't allow things bother me. My girlfriend breaks up with me after 3 years, I'm a little distraught, but I continue on a day later, I don't cry. But this is different. It defys all logic. Why? Because as a game designer, I've spent most of my life understanding how things work, what people what, what makes things fun. This game... This game shoves everything I've learned and shoves it up my ***. This is beyond all human nature, this game. I can't understand it....

The realism? Okay, I can understand to a certain degree, why people would like realism. But NOT, just NOT when it makes a game boring. People like satisfaction, it's what makes games, games. The satisfaction of accomplishing something. My friend told me, he'd spend a whole day fighting to capture a bunker and the next day it'd be taken over again. That's not satisfaction. It's a freakin game, guys! A game! It shouldn't require endless devotion like this guy is telling me about. I just dont understand it. Please try to explain yourselves to me, it will help me sleep better at night. I doubt I will ever be able to sleep again without knowing what makes people do this. Please tell me.

Thanks.

What game do you find to be fun?

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