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saronin

Perceived Equipment Imbalances

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Since the dawn of WWII Online there have been perceived equipment imbalances. There is nothing new about the claim that one side’s equipment is over powered or your side’s equipment is under powered. Remember WIllyTee’s hilarious videos like Top Opel, OMG Shot down by a Hurricane, and Shot up by a Stuka? They were funny as all get out but at their core were subtle pokes at equipment imbalance/deficiencies (If your new to the game and have not watched them go find them because they are awesome).

Lately, I’ve been hearing over and over that Axis armor does not stand up to Allied armor (OMG! Shermageddon). The way I see it, if you feel that way and simply cannot live with your current perception of the issue you have three choices.

1. Suck it up and deal with it. (While lighting up the forums about it of course!)

2. Rage Quit. (Your money and who am I to tell you what to do with it.)

3. Go play the other side.

I happen to encourage number 3 (especially if you’re thinking about rage quitting). Now before I get in to why... Let me respond to the inevitable” OMG! You have no self-respect! How dare you! What about squad/side loyalty! With an attitude like that you were destined to lose!” posts that I know are coming.

This is not a war. It is a game. I’ve been to a war. In fact I’ve been to two. On multiple occasions. Strangely, none of them looked like me staring at a screen and drinking copious amounts of alcohol while laughing at the fact that MrSnow wears a pink dress over TeamSpeak while simultaneously crashing a Stuka and then spawning back to life. So get off your high horse before you even get on it and realize that this is in fact a video game and as such does not demand type of Duty, Honor, Country, type loyalty you have in your mind.

Now… The reason I encourage number 3 on the list is that it does a number of things.

1. It challenges your perceptions. You have to put yourself in the shoes of the other side for a while. It creates a unique perspective, not to mention appreciation, for equipment you may not ever really use on the other side as well as your own side. In my case, I gained a new appreciation for the Stugb while playing Allied for about 3 years. You get to experience the strengths and weaknesses of the other side first hand. It might even make you a better player. Who knows?

2. If your perception of the equipment imbalance has lead you to the point of no longer having fun with the game it can restore said fun. It erases the perceived disadvantage in your mind and you can relax and have fun. Playing the game should not feel like work.

3. It buys some time for the development team to determine whether imbalances/deficiencies really do exist. If we all rage quit every time we lose the game won’t be around long. Give CRS a chance to make changes and evaluate the impact of those changes. In the mean time you are still having some fun without all the stress and drama.

See you in the field!

saronin

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1 - Has said by Xoom the tank armor will be audited and in some instances is not working correctly

*Edit confused slopped armor not working correctly with future Audit a few issues on the damage models.

2 - Having a closed system where you don't know what is the actual armor on each tank, the actual round penetration being calculated, where the crew and components are located. It's very natural and legitimate to have these perceptions.

3 - No easy way to debug it like you see on Warthunder..

4 - You can't choose where to put your ammo or how many to take so in some tanks with poorly layout ammunition they will instant blow from almost everyside.

No tank is 100% balance it's natural to have some imbalance because no tank was born equal..

For the sake of gameplay I would remove frontal degun from every tank until we have a tank repair system and track damage threshold that reduces mobility.

Edited by pbveteran

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1 - Has said by Xoom the slopped armor is not working correctly

I don't recall saying this?

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I don't recall saying this?

It was in one of your drunken stupors. Just roll with it. ;^)

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3. Go play the other side.

I do not want to spoil my history

but I'll try the other side

let's see how...

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I don't recall saying this?

Read somewhere on your website post when Victarius joined that there were some issues with slopped calculations or that it was being researched.

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I do not want to spoil my history

but I'll try the other side

let's see how...

Don't tell me you going to stay on the FB :P ... I only remember seeing you defending FB's since 2005, 11 years later you are still defending them and never saw you whine as well only comms.. ;)

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Read somewhere on your website post when Victarius joined that there were some issues with slopped calculations or that it was being researched.

You might be confusing that with us saying we planned on doing a complete vehicle audit for both armor thickness and ballistics, but I did not specifically say the armor values are not working. They are.

You may have also read that some rounds go through one side of the armor, out the other without hitting crew members or critical components that would destroy the vehicle. This is also true.

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You might be confusing that with us saying we planned on doing a complete vehicle audit for both armor thickness and ballistics, but I did not specifically say the armor values are not working. They are.

You may have also read that some rounds go through one side of the armor, out the other without hitting crew members or critical components that would destroy the vehicle. This is also true.

Hmm yeah that would be it I might have jump and associated with how slopped armor seems to be behaving overly generous on my end while on Warthunder I can easily take out Shermans and T34 with my IVG.

Make sure to take some prints and put those audited values on the wiki per vehicle to give us some more official transparency :)

Edited by pbveteran

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Hmm yeah that would be it I might have jump and associated with how slopped armor seems to be behaving overly generous on my end with slopped targets while on Warthunder I can easily take out Shermans and T34 with my IVG.

Make sure to take some prints and put those audited values on the wiki per vehicle to give us some more official transparency :)

Overmatch...

Shattergap...

Spaced armor...

All could change the armor game quite significantly. Scotsman did a series of posts discussing this a few years back. Very interesting to say the least. It would be extraordinarily hard to actually calculate it properly.

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Make sure to take some prints and put those audited values on the wiki per vehicle to give us some more official transparency :)

We have no plans to provide the player base specific numbers, because we need to be able to tweak and modify as we need. We will be fair, as close to accurate as we can get, while trying to balance the game all at the same time.

Our transparency over the last year has gone up in astronomical numbers, and where we can, we will continue to do that.

You seem to care about this game a great deal, and since you seem to have "veteran" in your tag I'm surprised you're not subscribed helping us be able to develop the game further. Even as a starter account that helps us out.

Thanks for playing all the same, do consider getting on the bandwagon of helping us deliver more to the game though.

S!

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Read somewhere on your website post when Victarius joined that there were some issues with slopped calculations or that it was being researched.

sloped - not slopped, lol.

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and since you seem to have "veteran" in your tag I'm surprised you're not subscribed helping us be able to develop the game further.

S!

Seem to be a lot of these lately. But why change your name? Do they get taken by someone else? He seems to want us to know he's a Vet but not who he is? Oh well.

I'm all for Balance... even in those big metal boxes I never use because I die EVERY TIME as Allied in them. :)

Edited by lipton

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sloped - not slopped' date=' lol.[/quote']

Heh, now I have a mental image of a factory worker with a giant ladle standing next to a big vat labeled "Armor" and a wet, lumpy tank. :D

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I do not want to spoil my history

but I'll try the other side

let's see how...

I tried to play as an ally for 3 hours.

does not

Experienced rifles they are really very bad..

I did not try the tank because I can not play ally tank and did not want to lose tanks.

unfortunately axis side will have to put up with me for a few days

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1. Numbering items in your posts makes your reply look organized.

2. I like to number things.

3. There was a three, but I forgot what it wuh...

4. Can't wait for the audits to be done.

5. Yeah, I'm gonna need you to go ahead and stay late to finish up those TPS reports, Peter.

6. Did you like the Lumberg reference?

7. Free to play veteran... Subscribe, dude, will you?

8.

There is no eight.

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Where is the honey spot to hit the tiger to de gun it?

Spawned 3 Tigers and fired maybe 3 rounds each time at two different tanks and within taking 2 to 4 rounds head on the Tigers gun was knocked out. One et was around 650 meters away the other 200. The gunner was never injured he was good, could shoot MG fine. Not a tanker just curious.

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We have no plans to provide the player base specific numbers, because we need to be able to tweak and modify as we need. We will be fair, as close to accurate as we can get, while trying to balance the game all at the same time.

Our transparency over the last year has gone up in astronomical numbers, and where we can, we will continue to do that.

You seem to care about this game a great deal, and since you seem to have "veteran" in your tag I'm surprised you're not subscribed helping us be able to develop the game further. Even as a starter account that helps us out.

Thanks for playing all the same, do consider getting on the bandwagon of helping us deliver more to the game though.

S!

1 - The fact you have no plans to provide does numbers rubs me the wrong way, Warthunder/StarCitizen even H&G are pretty open about similar values and systems.

2 - I will wait and see if you stand by your words that FRU only truck is a test on the live game not a feature mask as test, that will be implement either way just to give the illusion of choice to the player base. Only after testing the truck only fru, can people really make an informed vote and yes the results should be public.

3 - Even after that I still see people get banned here left and right, you guys should take some cues on the H&G forum, that forum feels like an actual forum people can have discussions and even criticize as long they are civil or provide constructive feedback.

4 - And even after that you guys seriously have to unban everyone especially subscribers, change TOS to not allow perma-bans or only on the extreme cases as hacking or making money with the game ingame exploits.

I wanna see all players that used to play the game again once more, CRS has created so many haters after MM, that you had to actually close the MMORPG forum and that there are a bunch of people who go to each article to rate it to 1... Unbanning everyone would mitigate and reduce the negative ratings with the launch on steam.

Anyways It's not 2012 anymore my addiction for a tank game with realistic damage and ballistic system is met in Warthunder, just here to see if I can influence some changes like I seem to have with changing the loading screens, making small additions, testing small adjustments per campaign and using crowdfunding for only development not marketing :)

5 - Other than those reasons not being met I could only see subscribing if the majority of the community would have more control on decisions or overrule yours decisions and that this voting would require to be a subscriber.

Edited by pbveteran

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Where is the honey spot to hit the tiger to de gun it?

Spawned 3 Tigers and fired maybe 3 rounds each time at two different tanks and within taking 2 to 4 rounds head on the Tigers gun was knocked out. One et was around 650 meters away the other 200. The gunner was never injured he was good, could shoot MG fine. Not a tanker just curious.

Muzzle brake I think...

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Where is the honey spot to hit the tiger to de gun it?

Spawned 3 Tigers and fired maybe 3 rounds each time at two different tanks and within taking 2 to 4 rounds head on the Tigers gun was knocked out. One et was around 650 meters away the other 200. The gunner was never injured he was good, could shoot MG fine. Not a tanker just curious.

I sat 1100M outside of B oom this evening and racked up nine kills in a Tiger while everyone else got instapopped... How?

I was in the middle of some trees, and pretty hidden. Others were approaching over an open field fromt heFB and kept the attentnion on them while I wasted 3 Sherm 76s, 3 sherms a stu, various other things. A good run.

Got to stay hidden and move if necessary... it helps to have squaddies calling tanks out to you as well.

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1 - The fact you have no plans to provide does numbers rubs me the wrong way, Warthunder/StarCitizen even H&G are pretty open about similar values and systems.

2 - I will wait and see if you stand by your words that FRU only truck is a test on the live game not a feature mask as test, that will be implement either way just to give the illusion of choice to the player base. Only after testing the truck only fru, can people really make an informed vote and yes the results should be public.

3 - Even after that I still see people get banned here left and right, you guys should take some cues on the H&G forum, that forum feels like an actual forum people can have discussions and even criticize as long they are civil or provide constructive feedback.

4 - And even after that you guys seriously have to unban everyone especially subscribers, change TOS to not allow perma-bans or only on the extreme cases as hacking or making money with the game ingame exploits.

I wanna see all players that used to play the game again once more, CRS has created so many haters after MM, that you had to actually close the MMORPG forum and that there are a bunch of people who go to each article to rate it to 1... Unbanning everyone would mitigate and reduce the negative ratings with the launch on steam.

Anyways It's not 2012 anymore my addiction for a tank game with realistic damage and ballistic system is met in Warthunder, just here to see if I can influence some changes like I seem to have with changing the loading screens, making small additions, testing small adjustments per campaign and using crowdfunding for only development not marketing :)

5 - Other than those reasons not being met I could only see subscribing if the majority of the community would have more control on decisions or overrule yours decisions and that this voting would require to be a subscriber.

Wow, you must be an ex-WWIIOL'er with a major axe to grind......

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Everyone knows Axis armor sux and has been that way for the last several years. The Axis armor game is about dead and it should be addressed soon. While the Axis side still has a few players left.

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Wow' date=' you must be an ex-WWIIOL'er with a major axe to grind......[/quote']

Nah... I have no time for WW2OL just here because of holiday break and WW2ol Patch, back to college and all my play time is spend on WT and other forums.

Those things are what takes me to get back here and I'm sure that a bunch as well of Vets which I reckon is enough to sustain financially and content wise the game.

I'm not willing to put money, if I think mistakes of the past that led to here are going to happen again and seem already happening again with only positive quotes about this change, no public results of the vote, no time set for this public test and no information of a new public vote so we can all make an inform decision.

Also implementing the sapper and setting back the ATR with just ATR shows to me a lack of vision and understanding of the game and game design.. but those are just my 0.02 cents

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Everyone knows Axis armor sux and has been that way for the last several years. The Axis armor game is about dead and it should be addressed soon. While the Axis side still has a few players left.

daywalker,

Feedback is good. What specifically about Axis armor sux? I think it would help CRS to know what the Axis player base perceives as the problem.

For example, the thing I question from the Axis perspective armor wise is that I tend to lose slug fests in a PZ3H vs a Stuart. This confuses me as I thought the Stuart was a light tank and that the 3H should have reasonable armor against a 37 MM. Perhaps a problem with the 50 MM on the 3H? However, I am not a ballistics expert (very few of us here actually are, some just think they are) so maybe I'm wrong. Again this my perception, maybe others see it differently.

The other issue I have is the Matilda MK II in Tier 0. It is an excepted fact that in the Battle of France Matilda MK IIs were largely impervious to German tank fire. That is an interesting historical aspect to the game. However, Matilda MK IIs were rare with only 23 of them seeing service in the battle. The question is, how doe CRS balance the historical accuracy there with numbers in game. Obviously they can't limit the entire British army to 23 Matildas MK IIs. What is the answer to balance historical accuracy with game play? Maybe move the pak 38 to Tier 0? I mean, are we not using the Gewehr 41 in Tier 0 at this point?

I also heard XOOM during the Rat Chat mention that the 88 needs to be looked at. Is that the 88 ATG or the 88 on the Tiger as well? Is there some sort of problem with the Tiger vs the S76 as a result? Maybe XOOM can elaborate on what CRS sees as a potential problem here so players can give some feedback.

In any case, I think specific constructive feedback is helpful. The only other option is to make a series of hilarious video cartoon productions depicting what we see as the problem.

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you know what , war is like that , your enemy's rifle may be more accurate than yours , or the rear of there tank is weak and yours is strong , or maybe the brit is just a better shot , so dont make it equal , give the weapons and vehicles there actual stats

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