• Announcements

    • BLKHWK8

      Squad Rat Chats   06/28/2018

      We will be having an Axis Squad and Allied Squad Rat Chat next month.  Please join us for a meeting with @XOOM @HATCH and @OHM to touch base with the Rats to go on a QA session.  Axis Squad Chat - July 28, 2018 2pm Server Time Allied Squad Chat - July 29, 2018 2pm Server Time.
snappled

Down to Rifles

52 posts in this topic

Think of how many times you have heard this. Or it's cousin .... "There is nothing here except rifles"

And why is that? A: Because almost nobody ever chooses to play with a rifle in the first place, so that is what is left after the fun part of the fight has ended. Talking about the basic infantry rifle here too, not the Sniper guns or the ATR's .... or for that matter the other special units like Engineer, Sapper, or Mortar that also carries a rifle. Just the basic infantryman. The semi's are obviously popular too. But if the basic rifle was actually fun to use, that would be the first item to get depleted in the spawn lists. As it is (mostly) useless in CQC, and at least half the game is nothing but CQC .... why then is the spawn list so heavily weighted with rifles??? A full spawn list should have 300 SMG's and 35 rifles, NOT the way it is now.

Can we swtich this around? How about giving the players the weapons they want to use, rather than forcing players (and this will mainly affect defenders the most I think) to grab something they do not even want to use? We are paying for this afterall .... shouldn't we be able to get the equipment we want to use when in the game?

I'll tell you what I do when a town needs a defense. Grrab an SMG and go check a CP, then head out to hunt for the FMS/FRU/EMS....whatever. If the SMG's are gone, I try to grab a unit that carries an automatic pistol as the backup weapon (so the British units are out of contention there too ... Webley just doesn't have the rate of fire or clip size to be helpful), because you can still clear a CP pretty effectively with an automatic. Failing that, I will resort to an LMG (I play Allied so LMG isn't exactly a first choice as it is with the Germans). But once that stuff is gone, I seldom then grab a rifle .... and I just move on to the next town.

That is exaclty what I just did in fact ..... selected a town that had two CP's down .... saw the remnants of the spawn list (which included still 145 rifles), and instead of helping with the defense .... just moved on instead. At least until the game CTD'd. Then, I came in here to spend some time [censored]ing instead.

So what do you think? Increase the SMG's and decrease the rifles? Great idea, yes? No new coding or skin designing or balistics development or steam preparation required.

<S>

Edited by snappled
spelling

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Reduce the number of SMGs, way to many in game for the early tiers.

If I recall correctly, german squad leaders were the only ones with SMGs during 1940s, so that would be 10% (a bit more actually counting HQ units).

The base SMG is 75 (not including all the reserve and 2nd tier ones), I'd go 25 base for tier 0, 50 for tier 1 and the current 75 for tier 2 on.  Adjust the others proportionately.

I think the the game would be a lot more fun with more rifle fights, not 300 SMGs vis 300 SMGs.  The current number, imo, of SMGs in tier 0 is ridiculous.

Edited by delems

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just always take rifles and not worry about it.

 

Big wins to take out SMGs and LMGs with rifles too.

 

Being able to surge MGs when it's town saving or taking time is key too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's always been a design tension between the product/experience desires of customers like Snappled and customers like Kilemall.

CRS has always done their best to walk a tightrope between these two diametrically opposed views, and to please every customer to the best of their ability.

But even so, the game can't be perfect both ways at once, and sometimes decisions have had to be made.

In the early days, it was said by Rats a number of times that there were quite a few games out there offering the first gameplay-style, and only a very few (maybe just one) offering the latter.

Many of the games from the former group are long gone.

Maybe that design choice to be the best product in a niche instead of an also-ran in a crowded market-space isn't why this game is still here. Certainly CRS's survival appears to have been a close-run thing at times. My guess though is that CRS does think their design approach has been important to their survival.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

awhile back i suggested giving the riflemen pistols...

they'd still be outclassed by LMG's and SMG's in CQB, but at least the goofy-bolt-dance's would go away.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You're only down to rifles because there are more rifles than smgs.

If you had 75 smg and 75 rifles probably the rifles run out at the same speed, depending on the type of battle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, monsjoex said:

You're only down to rifles because there are more rifles than smgs.

If you had 75 smg and 75 rifles probably the rifles run out at the same speed, depending on the type of battle.

That's an interesting theory ... I don't use both types equally, but perhaps the majority of other players do?

Look, I'm not saying the rifle doesn't have a place in the game. I couldn't even count the number of times I've been caught out in the middle of an open field with an SMG, while an enemy rifle plinks me from 250m away. But to suppress the EFMS until an engy arrives you need something like the SMG once you cross that field. Likewise clearing the CP's .. absurd to think of doing that with a rifle when there is likely to be a German LMG in there.

We need the right tools for the job .. and the job lately is dominated by just two activities; clearing CP's and suppressing FMS's. That has been 98% of my gameplay in recent weeks. And when we run out of the right tool .... well I just move on, and I think most other players do too.

<S>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Being down to rifles is one of the hazards of attrition and is something we should see more of in game. TOEs has made everyone spoiled and used to getting whatever equipment they want when they want it. As a result seeing some of the equipment in game is like seeing a unicorn on the battlefield. Less desired equipment becomes more of a novelty. The rifle was the basic and most prevalent unit of the war. And good simulation should reflect that. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, snappled said:

That's an interesting theory ... I don't use both types equally, but perhaps the majority of other players do?

Look, I'm not saying the rifle doesn't have a place in the game. I couldn't even count the number of times I've been caught out in the middle of an open field with an SMG, while an enemy rifle plinks me from 250m away. But to suppress the EFMS until an engy arrives you need something like the SMG once you cross that field. Likewise clearing the CP's .. absurd to think of doing that with a rifle when there is likely to be a German LMG in there.

We need the right tools for the job .. and the job lately is dominated by just two activities; clearing CP's and suppressing FMS's. That has been 98% of my gameplay in recent weeks. And when we run out of the right tool .... well I just move on, and I think most other players do too.

<S>

Many allied use rifles, even in depot fighting,  to spare the smgs.  Axis always have the upper hand due to the higher k/d's so its important to spawn rifles too. Also the lmg kind of sucks so in the field many prefer a rifle as well while axis lmg does fine in depots and in the field.

If you add more lmgs youll make the infantry more imbalanced.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Decrease the supply of SMGs and LMGs and you'll have more rifle users. Rifles don't need pistol or anything special.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, gretnine said:

Decrease the supply of SMGs and LMGs and you'll have more rifle users. Rifles don't need pistol or anything special.

...or, fewer players ...

<S>

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, snappled said:

...or, fewer players ...

<S>

Possibly. I for one ain't touching a rifle against an army of LMGs, unless theres nothing else left. Seems to be the case for many others too. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

On ‎03‎.‎03‎.‎2017 at 3:37 AM, snappled said:

A full spawn list should have 300 SMG's and 35 rifles, NOT the way it is now.

 

WTF ARE U MAD?!

everything is fine with rifle, its a support class and the most easiest thing new players can do is run with other players, listen to them and support em with ammo

this way they will easily learn the game, if they start with smg or mg they wouldnt know how to play it right and just die 20sec after spawn because most new players use bf1/cod tactics and just wanna rush in

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

If you're going to make players rely on bolt action rifles, at least make combat realistic.  Allow us to fix bayonets on them or buttstroke the enemy soldier in the face with the butt of the rifle then kill him while he's unconscious.  As it is now, you can't get into close combat with a bolt action rifle.  By the time you switch to the combat knife, the other player has already shot you.  No wonder no one wants to go into town, into close-quarters CP fighting, with them.  I would love a bit of realism here.  I'd have my avatar grab the rifle by the barrel end, c.o.c.k. it up like a baseball bat, and stand next to the CP door.  NEXXXXT!!!!!  :)

 

 

 

-Irish

 

 

Edited by odonovan1
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with odonovan. Rifle just needs something like a bayonet. CQC will still be dominated by SMGs and LMGs, but the basic rifleman still has a little defence from that range. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, mikeaz said:

not when your 61 years old they aren't.

And not with this crappy predictor code either

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, mikeaz said:

not when your 61 years old they aren't.

well 61 years old people has that patience for sure that are neeted for rifling, its not weapon of haste, patience patience and patience, with rush you only get pisshead childrens ;) i love it and will allways love it :P

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love the bolt rifles! When I die to anything else I think 'well they had the advantage anyway' so it is no big deal. I love being that tiny, insignificant grunt with a basic weapon. You want help in cqc? Run with teammates. You support then in longer range engagements and they return the favour in town.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I rather have a rifle than a smg at least while axis and in many cases over the lmg, it's more accurate and one hit kill. The only draw back is that it's fodder against tanks and the current predictor code at least for me in EU make rifleman nearly useless.

I wish there was a random probability that sometimes you spawned with a HEAT Satchel.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The smart folk take rifles.  I'll trade my rifles for MG34s and MP40s all day (or until you run out)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Remembering Counter Strike, most of the player base love to use AWM's, BGE's AWM IS the Rifle. One shot kill weapon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.