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lutenint

The TZ3 Dilemma

85 posts in this topic

8 hours ago, Pittpete said:

I wouldn't call him a troll but his side bias is blinding at times..

stop taking the bait you guys...

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1 hour ago, capco said:

I have a feeling a big reason for that is a general lack of interest.  This isn't Battleground Pacifica, it's Battleground Europe.

I don't know about now, but at one time the China server was running Battleground Side 1 vs. Side 2, with the national names scrubbed and modded from the game. 

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5 hours ago, major0noob said:

Chinese can't afford the subscription price, the ones that can likely have better options. their connections are even worse than the Russians anyways.

sure Asia has a huge population but how many of them have computers, a broadband internet connection, a (supported) GPU, and interest in niche western games.

 

i've played with a few asian clans/squads/guilds/whatever and they have a clear taste in games, "western style" genres have tiny followings; even then niche games like this one wouldn't stand a chance.

 

marketing WW2:OL to Asians is a real long shot.

Chinese have (had) their unofficial server for years, that should explain a lot. 

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On ‎4‎/‎27‎/‎2017 at 1:06 AM, undercova said:

^ This

 

and again ... come and play in TZ3. see how allies still fly with planes while they get rolled on the ground. sometimes there are even more planes in the sky than players on the ground.

magically this thing is no problem when allies are rolling. then suddenly the allied players log in fine and daily in TZ3 plus the sideswitchers.

you guys are trying to force CRS to do something by not logging into game. telling everyone that the TZ3 kills the game :D

ive seen many many campaigns when TZ2 was more like WW1 trench warfare. over days no town caps in that TZ. no one was able to cap a town. stuck at river line. that was the most boring phase ive ever seen/experienced.

It is obvious what side you play on typically. The thing is, look at the past 10 campaigns historically.

 

What really gets us (Allies) is, when we take towns during HIGH pop times and come back the next day and all those towns plus others are now axis.

It was mostly SC during the low pop time. This happened many times. That's what pizzes us off the most.

 

Yes I have played during the LOW pop times and have seen it for myself. Axis had at least 25 players and the allies had 5-7.

Now, explain to me how a 6 guys can defend a town against 25?

 

As of late I was glad to see some Axis come and join the allies. We won a map and now we are back to losing the next 2+.

Then they will come and play allies and we will win a map and then we are back to losing the next 2+.

Rinse and repeat.

 

Until such time as we can get both factions to be equally exciting to play, this will be forever thus. Lots of peeps like playing the so called bad guy side, cause

they are not that in RL. If you can come up with a plan to make ALL SIDES equally EXCITING, then this will solve the problem.

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how about building on the softcap and AO rule, so low-pop can't take 2 AB towns, huge cities, and AF towns.

loosing these ones cause the most grief

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15 hours ago, undercova said:

you play once a week. others play on a daily basis.

when you have your squad night you mostly capture towns ... quite a few every time so far.

so you want the other side to be punished because they negate your progress from squad night within a few hours too ? well they play more ... A LOT MORE than you. this is a 24/7 game. everyone can log in when he wants to.  everyone can decide which sides he wants to play to even is there a SD. every side has its basement of players who are fully dedicated to their side => hardcore players.

axis had a super effective squad night every sunday and wednesday too until a few years ago. when KGW and other squads left the game. should axis refuse to play too then ? :D

 

playing axis in TZ3 is a great feeling and experience imo. sure ... we are mostly more players than the allies during that TZ3 ... but the teamwork is MUCH BETTER than in other TZs. ppl enjoy it. plus add the "cool" allied pilots who think it would help more to fly a plane than help their side on the ground. 

Once again, READING IS FUNDAMENTAL

You obviously didn't read my post before holmium's little rant. I was actually defending TZ3's right to play.  But again... Reading is not your strong suit.

Btw, weren't you perma-banned? Oh, that's right. It was under another name. Now you're "undercova". How convenient is that. *rolls eyes*

Edited by lipton

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13 hours ago, holmium said:

 

My point is here, you judge us and blame us (TZ3) for rolling the map, undoing your hard work from your timezone. "Fighting AI" as you put it. Yet, we are just playing the game like you are, we just happen to be in a different part of the world, killing players on the other team.

 

 

I used to log into TZ3 occasionally, back in the day. It was futile. There would be 5 guys on the Allied side to 25 guys on the Axis side. 

So yeah. You do "kill people" and not just AI if you want to get technical. But if that's your best argument, it's weak at best.

But again... I am the one that said TZ3 has as much right to play as anyone else. You pay to play just like everyone else. I WAS DEFENDING YOU!  But go ahead and attack me. That'll help your cause. 

Edited by lipton
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23 hours ago, lipton said:

 

I used to log into TZ3 occasionally, back in the day. It was futile. 

It is not futile.  "Back in the day," there was a period where the Allies had lost 4 or 5 campaigns in a row, primarily because of TZ3 issues.  B2k became the Allied CINC and 22 SAS decided to go back to playing Allied.  I decided to go with them.  Now, mind you, 22 SAS is not a TZ3 squad and I am  not a TZ3 player.  22 SAS is a TZ1 squad (EURO) and I'm a TZ2 (US Primetime) player, but enough of us got together in late TZ3, 3AM-6AM, US Eastern, to make about ten to fifteen or so Allied players.  The goal wasn't to "win" in TZ3, but to simply "stop" the Axis in TZ3.  10-15 Allied players can "stop" 25-30 Axis players.  Once you "stop" the Axis in TZ3, Axis morale begins to suffer because they don't have the strength to "win" in TZ1 (the days of KGW/ASA are long gone) and they don't have the strength to "stop" the Allies in TZ2.

The rest is history.  The Allies ended up winning three campaigns in a row and I went back to the Axis side after that.  Mission accomplished.  22 SAS remained on the Allied side.  In the end, that is all you need, 10-15 dedicated players in late TZ3.  That may change with the Steam launch and numbers increase, but for right now, 10-15 players will do it.

If you can't find them, then there is something "else" wrong with your side that "balancing" TZ3 won't fix.

VR

Edited by csm308
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1 hour ago, csm308 said:

It is not futile.  "Back in the day," there was a period where the Allies had lost 4 or 5 campaigns in a row, primarily because of TZ3 issues.  B2k became the Allied CINC and 22 SAS decided to go back to playing Allied.  I decided to go with them.  Now, mind you, 22 SAS is not a TZ3 squad and I am  not a TZ3 player.  22 SAS is a TZ1 squad (EURO) and I'm a TZ2 (US Primetime) player, but enough of us got together in late TZ3, 3AM-6AM, US Eastern, to make about ten to fifteen or so Allied players.  The goal wasn't to "win" in TZ3, but to simply "stop" the Axis in TZ3.  10-15 Allied players can "stop" 25-30 Axis players.  Once you "stop" the Axis in TZ3, Axis morale begins to suffer because they don't have the strength to "win" in TZ1 (the days of KGW/ASA are long gone) and they don't have the strength to "stop" the Allies in TZ2.

The rest is history.  The Allies ended up winning three campaigns in a row and I went back to the Axis side after that.  Mission accomplished.  22 SAS remained on the Allied side.  In the end, that is all you need, 10-15 dedicated players in late TZ3.  That may change with the Steam launch and numbers increase, but for right now, 10-15 players will do it.

If you can't find them, then there is something "else" wrong with your side that "balancing" TZ3 won't fix.

VR

There are toys on the axis side that peeps want to play with, like tiger tanks and the '09s, etc. Not much excitement when it comes to allies.

When the game can generate excitement for both side near equally. Then you will see the numbers go up. When steam hits, it will be lots of axis and some allies. I would say at least 2 to 1.

Use the F2P, when they sign in, they go to low pop automatically. Not at a 50/50, lets say near it but not it. Most games automatically feed the low pop side. So it will not be something new to the new peeps. And it will be an incentive to get a Sub. so you can pick where you want to go.

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On 2017-4-27 at 3:14 PM, farquar69 said:

no game ask months pay but this ask month pay. why

If the sub really is a months pay in some TZ3 countries then maybe that needs looking into?

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4 minutes ago, Nick said:

If the sub really is a months pay in some TZ3 countries then maybe that needs looking into?

I dont think he is saying "a months pay". I think he is saying "No game asks you to pay monthly", which obviously isnt true as there are many games with monthly costs in order to play. He is probably thinking of pay once games like for consoles (which are even getting into monthly payments now).

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1 minute ago, Scking said:

I dont think he is saying "a months pay". I think he is saying "No game asks you to pay monthly", which obviously isnt true as there are many games with monthly costs in order to play. He is probably thinking of pay once games like for consoles (which are even getting into monthly payments now).

Oh yes, you are probably correct.

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1 hour ago, imded said:

There are toys on the axis side that peeps want to play with, like tiger tanks and the '09s, etc. Not much excitement when it comes to allies.

When the game can generate excitement for both side near equally. Then you will see the numbers go up. When steam hits, it will be lots of axis and some allies. I would say at least 2 to 1.

Use the F2P, when they sign in, they go to low pop automatically. Not at a 50/50, lets say near it but not it. Most games automatically feed the low pop side. So it will not be something new to the new peeps. And it will be an incentive to get a Sub. so you can pick where you want to go.

You know allies have Americans when Axis get the tiger. The tiger is a beast but personally I prefer playing American forces when they arrive. I can't be surprised if people have that same opinion because there's only a couple tigers in a spawn at a given time so they're never in supply anyways.

 

the issue is the TZ not necessarily equipment choice. Allies have awesome aircraft and varying weapons. Axis most the time have firepower and maneuverability (in tier0)

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2 hours ago, imded said:

There are toys on the axis side that peeps want to play with, like tiger tanks and the '09s, etc. Not much excitement when it comes to allies.

When the game can generate excitement for both side near equally. Then you will see the numbers go up. When steam hits, it will be lots of axis and some allies. I would say at least 2 to 1.

Use the F2P, when they sign in, they go to low pop automatically. Not at a 50/50, lets say near it but not it. Most games automatically feed the low pop side. So it will not be something new to the new peeps. And it will be an incentive to get a Sub. so you can pick where you want to go.

 

It's not up to the game to generate excitement, that's what the players are for. Since HC controls everything in this game if people aren't excited then it's because the side has collectively given up or the HC is garbage.

 

Sitting on AOs for as long as possible, placing the only AO to a town with no FB, and all sorts of passive-aggressive nonsense to get your team to go on defense doesn't build excitement. When you have HC that does this routinely it shouldn't be surprising when they have low population compared to the HC that enables attacking even if it isn't the safest option for the map. I think that I'm stating the obvious here but there are people in HC that have no experience with MMO guilds or running a community and want to play some kind of board game instead of organize and motivate their faction's players. As long as this going on any attempt to balance population is futile.

Edited by david01

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Got a problem.......sub up and contribute to the cause.  Don't like Hc........ join up help make things better..........otherwise.........err........nevermind.

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45 minutes ago, david01 said:

 

It's not up to the game to generate excitement, that's what the players are for. Since HC controls everything in this game if people aren't excited then it's because the side has collectively given up or the HC is garbage.

 

Sitting on AOs for as long as possible, placing the only AO to a town with no FB, and all sorts of passive-aggressive nonsense to get your team to go on defense doesn't build excitement. When you have HC that does this routinely it shouldn't be surprising when they have low population compared to the HC that enables attacking even if it isn't the safest option for the map. I think that I'm stating the obvious here but there are people in HC that have no experience with MMO guilds or running a community and want to play some kind of board game instead of organize and motivate their faction's players. As long as this going on any attempt to balance population is futile.

HC is open for anyone to join (that pays to play, no freeloaders) so anyone who thinks its easy to motivate players or to run the map, then join up. Help the player base and the game.

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6 minutes ago, Scking said:

HC is open for anyone to join (that pays to play, no freeloaders) so anyone who thinks its easy to motivate players or to run the map, then join up. Help the player base and the game.

I'm pretty sure david01 is above such peasant things.

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4 hours ago, imded said:

There are toys on the axis side that peeps want to play with, like tiger tanks and the '09s, etc. Not much excitement when it comes to allies.

When the game can generate excitement for both side near equally. Then you will see the numbers go up. When steam hits, it will be lots of axis and some allies. I would say at least 2 to 1.

Use the F2P, when they sign in, they go to low pop automatically. Not at a 50/50, lets say near it but not it. Most games automatically feed the low pop side. So it will not be something new to the new peeps. And it will be an incentive to get a Sub. so you can pick where you want to go.

I don't see where you've actually countered anything that I said.............................................................

VR

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12 hours ago, csm308 said:

It is not futile.  "Back in the day," there was a period where the Allies had lost 4 or 5 campaigns in a row, primarily because of TZ3 issues.  B2k became the Allied CINC and 22 SAS decided to go back to playing Allied.  I decided to go with them.  Now, mind you, 22 SAS is not a TZ3 squad and I am  not a TZ3 player.  22 SAS is a TZ1 squad (EURO) and I'm a TZ2 (US Primetime) player, but enough of us got together in late TZ3, 3AM-6AM, US Eastern, to make about ten to fifteen or so Allied players.  The goal wasn't to "win" in TZ3, but to simply "stop" the Axis in TZ3.  10-15 Allied players can "stop" 25-30 Axis players.  Once you "stop" the Axis in TZ3, Axis morale begins to suffer because they don't have the strength to "win" in TZ1 (the days of KGW/ASA are long gone) and they don't have the strength to "stop" the Allies in TZ2.

The rest is history.  The Allies ended up winning three campaigns in a row and I went back to the Axis side after that.  Mission accomplished.  22 SAS remained on the Allied side.  In the end, that is all you need, 10-15 dedicated players in late TZ3.  That may change with the Steam launch and numbers increase, but for right now, 10-15 players will do it.

If you can't find them, then there is something "else" wrong with your side that "balancing" TZ3 won't fix.

VR

If I can't find them? Pretty damn sure it's not my job to find 10 or 15 players that want to play WWIIOL during TZ3. lol  

And obviously, what you did was futile. It it weren't ... then there would be no TZ3 problem. Am I right? 

What you did was a temporary stop-gap to a long-term problem. What we did was a temporary stop-gap to a long-term problem. AKA... futile

But like I said. They pay to play, just like everyone else. LET THEM PLAY.   Geez!  I would swear we were speaking the same language. But obviously not. 

Edited by lipton

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so if we can't stop typing nasty stuff at eachother - some will be taking vacations from the forum.

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21 hours ago, Scking said:

HC is open for anyone to join (that pays to play, no freeloaders) so anyone who thinks its easy to motivate players or to run the map, then join up. Help the player base and the game.

It is easy to motivate players in an online game. It's more difficult to get results here because the FPS gameplay has been made as dull and tedious as possible, but the gist is still the same. That's why one person can have 25 people show up to capture an empty town (and gets mocked for it strangely enough), and another posts in the forums about not be able to keep 25 players logged in at all despite making the proper map moves. I'm not paying money to be someone else's game manager though.

 

Again you can make whatever rule you want to curtail map activity during TZ3 (or TZ1 if euro prime ever gets rolling again), but as long as your game managers believe in "running the map" over keeping the users engaged you're not going to fix a lack of population. If I were the devs I'd remove every HC volunteer that wanted to play with flags on a map instead of organizing other players, but in a way that's what they're doing with the town supply thing.

 

If the shift to some kind of town supply isn't just marketing then a good amount of the drama surrounding TZ3 is going away. There will be no softcaps and it will be much harder to have big breakthroughs. The devs can calibrate the spawn lists off of the prime time burn rate and TZ3 will have trouble wearing towns down. With no map to run the "strategic" board game goes away and HC will change a quite a bit.

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It still comes down to  5-10 Allies on when 20+ Axis on during TZ3. Tough to fight against overwhelming forces MOST OF THE TIME.

So, when Allies win a few towns then lose double+ that by the next day. Yes that is a morale killer, means less Allies logging in.

Simple math here folks.

 

Me, I am only playing for fun now. Don't care anymore if we win or lose the map. For the enjoyment only.

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5 hours ago, imded said:

It still comes down to  5-10 Allies on when 20+ Axis on during TZ3. Tough to fight against overwhelming forces MOST OF THE TIME.

So, when Allies win a few towns then lose double+ that by the next day. Yes that is a morale killer, means less Allies logging in.

Simple math here folks.

 

Me, I am only playing for fun now. Don't care anymore if we win or lose the map. For the enjoyment only.

 

On ‎4‎/‎29‎/‎2017 at 11:35 PM, lipton said:

If I can't find them? Pretty damn sure it's not my job to find 10 or 15 players that want to play WWIIOL during TZ3. lol  

Playing for enjoyment only is fine, but if you wish to win, without the help of others coming over to play, sometimes you have to do for yourself.  If you are unwilling to do for yourself, well.................

VR

Edited by csm308

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18 hours ago, imded said:

It still comes down to  5-10 Allies on when 20+ Axis on during TZ3. Tough to fight against overwhelming forces MOST OF THE TIME.

So, when Allies win a few towns then lose double+ that by the next day. Yes that is a morale killer, means less Allies logging in.

Simple math here folks.

 

Me, I am only playing for fun now. Don't care anymore if we win or lose the map. For the enjoyment only.

You know it's a catch 22 situation?...........if the shoes were on the other foot the "dilemma" would be from the other sides perspective.

Why oh why do these threads pop up every campaign? We all know TZ3 is a problem.......for both sides at different times, yet there always legitimate gripes but there is OBVIOUSLY nothing that can be done in the short term.  Hopefully it's addressed at some point in the future.......hopefully 1.36 helps.........hopefully steam release brings in an influx of players to help the situation.........hopefully the RATS are aware (they are).........hopefully we can stop bringing this up every campaign.

Image result for beating a dead horse gif

1 minute ago, bmw said:

double post deleted

 

Edited by bmw

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On 5/3/2017 at 7:37 AM, bmw said:

You know it's a catch 22 situation?...........if the shoes were on the other foot the "dilemma" would be from the other sides perspective.

Why oh why do these threads pop up every campaign? We all know TZ3 is a problem.......for both sides at different times, yet there always legitimate gripes but there is OBVIOUSLY nothing that can be done in the short term.  Hopefully it's addressed at some point in the future.......hopefully 1.36 helps.........hopefully steam release brings in an influx of players to help the situation.........hopefully the RATS are aware (they are).........hopefully we can stop bringing this up every campaign.

Image result for beating a dead horse gif

 

Actually this post was dated before this camp. Allies were winning and axis were getting destroyed. My argument was it's not fun when one TZ determines the map, because i would log on only to see 12 towns taken (on our side) and it's boring honestly. 

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