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Rotschild

A New Approach to Spying...

12 posts in this topic

S! WW2 ppl,

Spies, as much as we all hate them, are a huge part of the game.  There might not be many of the a holes that do it, but those few can make a huge impact.  I propose making spying a legal part of the game.  Spying was, after all, a HUGE part of WW2 and so, if we wish to make the game as authentic as possible, why not introduce it as another interesting aspect of WW2 online?  and make it something we can regulate through the gaming community and not a regulation on the part of the game moderators.  It would be an extention of the sand box platform.  There are many pros to making this happen, and I don't have all the kinks thought out.  This is just a proposal.  Here are my few ideas as I see them so far.. I'm hoping others can add on or call BS...

What will have to be done is more power to squads in game some how.. maybe AO placement, planning etc,, Im not sure of the extent of how this might happen.  But this way squads can control the game and thus control their members and determine if they are spies.  They will need MUCH stronger recruitment requirements.  Voice comms will be an absolute MUST!  The point is that any non-squad affiliated player will not have the necessary information to spy without being in a squad.(for example, a "lone wolf" cannot see ao until a certain criteria is met, has a lack of ability to see friendly units, and maybe a lack of comms) 

The difficult part will be implimenting it in a way that if spying does occur it will be considered a slight on the part of the squads OR that it will be considered an exploit.. There is a lot of grey area here.  I have not, admittedly, figured out this end of it.  Perhaps there are some other ideas out there.

Pros of adding spies...

  • It will add authenticity to the game.
  • It will get rid of ppl whining about spying, because the PB will now be responsible for spies.
  • It will add strength to squads.  We are getting rid of HC anyway, so i say lets add more power to sqauds in game.
  • It will have a huge impact on players joining discord and squads.  Because if they don't they will be considered spies.  (There are some exceptions here of course with players we all know that have played the game for years and might not be in a squad..)
  • It will improve squad communication.
  • It will lessen the workload of CRS game managers.
  • It will be more fun for PB once they realize the potential for joining squads and squad comms.

Cons of adding spies...

  • It will be difficult to introduce and require much testing before it is perfected to determine what is considered spying and what is an exploit.
  • Squads will have to in some way become the major acting/influencing force in game in order to deter nonsquad players from becoming spies.  * I havent' worked out this part yet, looking for ideas here.

Finally, as an example of how well this could work, in EVE online spying is considered an essential part of the game.  It is a VERY big concern for squads in game.  BUT, it has added authenticity to the game as well as adding voice comms and a very stringent, but necessary, squad recruitment policy.  It adds a new layer to the game and its all legal and not considered an exploit.  And, it has the benefit of getting rid of the hassles on game managers having to worry about that part of the game.

 

Its a very raw idea and I don't have it totally worked out.  Lots of great ideas on these forums from players.  I'm hoping to hear some other thoughts... 

 

 

Edited by rotschild

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I think its a ton of work for a "non combat" unit to be modeled with unique abilities. 

On a related note, It would be foolish to think that gamey tactics are not used.

However, spying is much much less of an issue than some believe it to be.

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24 minutes ago, rotschild said:

fair enough, want to expand on that?

 

because there's many more important things to focus on.  

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2 minutes ago, Kidd27 said:

I think its a ton of work for a "non combat" unit to be modeled with unique abilities. 

On a related note, It would be foolish to think that gamey tactics are not used.

However, spying is much much less of an issue than some believe it to be.

totally agree with your last statement.  as far as non comambatants, I don't think modelling has anything to do with this.  There are no unique abilities that need to be added as far as programming.  The work would be with game mechanics, not modelling.

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46 minutes ago, bob5 said:

because there's many more important things to focus on.  

I agree bob, there def are.. It's more of a theoretical discussion rather than practical.. We all know CRS only have so many cards to play at this point.  This doesn't mean we can't discuss it though.  But, again, yes, i agree, there are more pressing issues on the table.  

Let's imagine CRS has a sugar daddy and can do what they wish.  If that was the case, what would be your stance on this?  I geniunely think it could add tons of authenticity, depth, and immersion/replayability to the game while also lightening the the load on CRS.

PS, I'm not just posting this as a pipe dream.. I imagine the goal is to someday get to the point where WW2 online have the means to address these sort of issues.  So its fun to discuss them for now, if only out of pure dreamfulness.  Just my opinion, an old chunk of coal.

Edited by rotschild

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I think if it required more than logging into the other side, and looking than I could be ok with it, if it were a mechanic I could get down with that.

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Id have to vote NO to spies as in log into the others side, listen to their HC comms etc.
That just doesn't make for much fun.

Now, say you wanted to introduce a Spy player unit, that wore the enemies uniform (though not a perfect match) and could like translate area chat (Not tuned stations) and have no ability to trip flags and something of that nature, ok. Maybe give the guy no ammo, or a pistol with only 2 mags. Maybe AI doesnt shoot him to pieces.
Youd be able to catch him, his clothes dont exactly match, and after a while you realize he has no tag, and all he can do is relay what he sees, and happens to hear on area chat, he doesnt know the missions, who is on them, what HC is saying, what the plans are, etc.  Maybe let him be understood in area chat, but throw in a chance to obfuscate a word, so he can try to gain info but at risk of getting caught when he suddenly blurts out an enemy word.
Perhaps his name in chat comes up as something random like bob or hans or pierre

Dont know if it is worth the effort to make, but i could live with something like that.
At least it is playable, and stoppable and cant cause terrible harm

Edited by merlin51

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a unique unit is an interesting idea.  I guess what I was thinking was more along the lines of, for example, adding a unique api code to each account.  This code would have included all history of activity on both sides for that account which could be tracked by squad recruiters.  If you wanted to join a squad they would ask you for your code to check up on you.  In this scenario f2p accounts would most likely not be accepted into squads because of a lack of information.  New paying players would have to join a squad and be active in game and on comms to prove themselves.  It would be a bit of a climb for new players.  however, f2p players could still enjoy the basics of the game if they choose not to join a squad.  They would be limited in what they know about new aos and unit movements, in the same way they are limited in weapons they can use.   Another added bonus might be discouraging side switching.  If you side switch without being in a squad you will have very limited info on what is going on. 

I like the spy unit idea as well..

Edited by rotschild

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CRS needs to look at such ideas from the perspective of how many customers would like it, and how many wouldn't. My guess on this one based on observation since about day 1 is that a few percent at most would like it, and the rest would be appalled. Collaborative gameplay would mostly end except among highly secretive squads. Willingness to assist green tags would be greatly diminished. The game would be about spying, not operations and fighting. The net result would be highly destructive of CRS's market survival ability.

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On 7/8/2017 at 11:16 PM, rotschild said:

I like the spy unit idea as well..

That is about the only way you would get any reasonable portion of a pvp realistic historical war sim community to say Ok Cool to sanctioned spies, if the "spy" was simply a game unit that they could find recognize and kill and had very limited spying abilities.
And you could partially pull that off now, if you are sneaky enough.

It definitely would not be a top priority project in any time frame i could imagine though

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