firebugs

For the next infantry weapon overhaul

11 posts in this topic

I just started playing again recently after a couple years of on/off due to garbage internet service and work and pursuing a mechanical engineering degree.  There are a few things I've noticed that could use a once-over-- some of them have been around for a long time.

 

- K98 zf39 and No.4 mk1(T) reloading via clips through the scope.

This was a shortcut taken when the sniper class was first introduced into the game to get the patch out before whatever year's Christmas it was.  Both of these rifles should reload like the Lebel and M1903a4 currently do, 1 round at a time into the top of the magazine.

 

-G43 Reload is too fast

-MG34 Reload is entirely too fast

 

- Sniper scope drops while moving

I don't know why/when this was changed but it's garbage.  I have a couple WWII era sniper rifles and I'd be happy to give a live-fire demonstration video on how they can be used while walking forward, just like open-sighted rifles

 

-SMG accuracy is hideous.

What is going on is there is a really wide cone of fire (dispersion) applied to the weapon in general, along with some recoil effects.  What it should be is a small cone of fire with some recoil effect.  These style weapons are literally the easiest thing to control and deliver accurate (albeit close-range) fully automatic fire.  I was issued an Mp5 for 2 years and we would routinely dump 30 round magazines into a torso target at 25m in one continuous burst during training.  Pure mechanical accuracy of the system should be no worse than about a fist-sized group at 25m-- ANY other dispersion is from automatic recoil.  Taking single shots or small bursts should be deadly effective to 100-150m.  What currently happens is about the same "spread" whether you fire single shots, small bursts, or one continuous burst.  That's not right.

 

-Pistol accuracy is pretty loose

It could be significantly better.  Whatever dispersion you're using, like halve or third it.

 

-K98 zf39 sniper rifle shoots about .5 milliradians high and favors the left, a simple zero audit.

 

-LMG hip firing

My suggestion:

-Mg34; Should be able to hip fire, 10-15 round burst max, NOT while moving.

-Bren/Fm29; Should be just like the BAR is currently.

 

 

-I've heard through the grapevine Scotsman is working on small-arms ballistics; my age-old gripe yet remains.  Ballistic coefficients being used are pretty much all wrong.  Wrong enough that I can tell outright, except the French 7.5mm stuff.

Unfortunately I've lost most all of the research I did on this subject but I'm willing to help and see what I can do towards solving this issue.  I have several hundred rounds of each caliber used in game (minus 8mm Lebel) of original WWII ammo, as well as quite a bit of chronograph, range-finding, and ballistics equipment/software/experience.  I may yet be able to make some real-world testing happen to prove my point.

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The SMG dispersion has been a hotly debated topic here, and I've been pushing for the idiotic spray to be tamed for a long time.

 

I know that the HE/KE/small arms audits are either done or near completion. 

@scotsman I can't find the topic about it but maybe you can fill him in.

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While you're at it mg34 tank fire, non dispersion versus the French bizarre spray it everywhere approach.

Edited by goreblimey
typo

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5 hours ago, goreblimey said:

While you're at it mg34 tank fire, non dispersion versus the French bizarre spray it everywhere approach.

Yeah, it's like a water hose.

I don't think the S35 really had a water cannon IRL.

 

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The game has increasing cones of fire for some weapons, so that's already in the system. The parameters are just awful for SMGs for some odd reason and for the longest time people were playing dumb as if they were realistic. For the SMGs it's a ridiculously huge starting cone, and the RNG means that one bullet will land outside the rear sight post, one close to the point of aim, and another way off target. So unlike the LMGs there's no incentive to burst fire or take single shots. As if the game was designed around forcing players to get as close as possible and mag dump each other.

 

And that's just the firearms. Grenades are gimped because it takes four whole seconds to throw a grenade. With switching back and forth and not even taking the time to aim that's five seconds of you being unable to run or fire. Even a simple grenade button like Arma has would have a dramatic impact on infantry gameplay because so much of the fighting is room-to-room. Right now a SMG can be outside the depot building and literally run up a flight of stairs and shoot you before you can finish throwing your grenade and pull your main weapon back out.

 

There were all kinds of bad tweaks made to the game over the years and nothing should be taken for granted.

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All the small ams have been audited but we aren't done with modifying how the data is handled by the code. The two weapons we have 'fixed' in test  perform exactly to spec in dispersion so stay tuned...

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2 hours ago, scotsman said:

The two weapons we have 'fixed' in test  perform exactly to spec in dispersion so stay tuned...

OK, now I'm even more excited. If this is true small arms combat is going to get really good.

Best tactic now in ranges of 5-50yd is just to spray the upper torso and head area hoping for a critical hit.

I'm staying tuned, fo shezee

 

 

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1 hour ago, vasduten1 said:

OK, now I'm even more excited. If this is true small arms combat is going to get really good.

Best tactic now in ranges of 5-50yd is just to spray the upper torso and head area hoping for a critical hit.

I'm staying tuned, fo shezee

 

 

That is a bad tactic. That kind of shooting tends to damage backpacks. 

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57 minutes ago, saronin said:

That is a bad tactic. That kind of shooting tends to damage backpacks. 

Yeah, I'd rather have less dispersion so I don't damage backpacks

 

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I don't know about the 98k, but surely a #4 Enfield would simply have a number of extra magazines, so could insert a magazine of 10 rounds from below if needbe, as opposed to a single round each time from above? I presume a German sniper would do the same thing, but with 5 round magazines. At which point, spending dev time on this would seem superfluous, yes it's currently incorrect, but no, it makes no real difference. That said, replacing the magazine on an Enfield is not easy to do, it requires a great deal of strength in the fingers to depress the release.

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Fidd, No extra no.4 mk1 magazines were issued as far as I know, and the K98 has an integral box magazine, there is no way to detach it (well, you can, but the trigger guard comes with it and it requires unscrewing 4 screws... obviously it doesn't work for reloading).

It was specifically stated in German manuals not to remove the scope in the SSR and LSR models to reload via stripper clips, also.  Though it is technically possible, I doubt it's faster, and it risks losing mechanical zero of the weapon.

 

Theoretically possible that the No.4 could reload with a complete magazine swap, but I think more research needs to be done to see if this was actual practice or not, my gut feeling is "no".

 

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