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wildcat382

Axis thinks they are good

119 posts in this topic

4 minutes ago, Lob12 said:

Was a honest question. I've been out of the loop.

Maybe it was just the optic ? 

Optic is fubar atm yes.
It is like shooting an ATG by using a microscope.
Im sure it will get fixed though, other gunsights just got new ones

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10 minutes ago, Lob12 said:

Was a honest question. I've been out of the loop.

Maybe it was just the optic ? 

we did bring the crew to this side of 2001, no munition changes though

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The only Pak36 ammo change I know of occurred many years ago.  Lower penetration is expected from the Pak36 after the KE/ammo audit, afaik.  

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4 hours ago, Mosizlak said:

It can go both ways, thrance. 

Disable the chat/voice comms for most french tankers since a ton of them were missing their radios. 1 man turrets meant you loaded, sighted the gun and fired. You lose the sight picture while you reload and I'd dare to guess the rate of fire would go down.  

Sounds fun, doesn't it? 

coms would be hard to enforce, though you are correct, not a chance in hell of enforcing it, to many external options.

Turrets, I'd like to see those eventually remodeled
Loading animation where your head leaves the gunsight, even the B1 all you got if you were lucky was a 47mm round handed to you from below.
Even if it does nothing to raw rate of fire, it would feel more authentic

And i'd make the commander view part of the gun view, ditch position 2
and have you slide up and down from cupola to gun.

That would most likely take a major redoing of the mechanics system for vehicles
because that was a problem they ran into way back at the beginning, PZIIc and 38t suffer from it too, binocs and gun tubes fused, yet not aligned.
in reality should be able to swap between and move independently.

But i'd do it, it would be kind of fun, to me anyways, it would add a new twist or challenge.
I would make it so if you hold the trigger down, you dont go into reload cycle though
(Added bonus, that stops end of life auto firing)

 

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3 hours ago, B2K said:

though a campaign with 'real' %'s throughout the force (well real-ish given the missing equipment) could be fun as there'd be a billion rifles, a few thousand SMG and a few hundred LMGS  (replicated across all branches of course)

I would be all about a one time special event where it was rifles vs rifles only..I infact, think that would be a hoot.

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15 hours ago, merlin51 said:

Well, depending on range it is on the flank.
The game does not have cumulative damage VS armor, so technically everything is "one shotted"
just depends on how many tries it takes you to properly place the 1 shot i guess?

40mm armor on flanks
Pak 36 500m 31mm 
100m 64mm

So from 500m and up, its either going to spall a lot or its going to go in, unless angle is bad of course.

 

Exactly Merlin. Excellent point. That's what we see in this game in the Pak36 performance.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I would also like to add, that's the penetration table for AP.40 not pzgr ammo.

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4 hours ago, stankyus said:

I would also like to add, that's the penetration table for AP.40 not pzgr ammo.

also @30°

PzGr.39 is 48mm @500m @90° and 36mm @500m @30°

Both within enter or spall you territory

S35 is cast armor, Its very hard and i guess you could say very slippery as far as biting into its angles
But it has a downside also, if you get a certain percentage through it, its worse than plain RHA spalling.
So if pak gun gets near the normal spalling area, you probably have big chunks of cast flying around.
 

On the flip side, dont expect every round you fire to go BANG guaranteed XXX penetration
real life doesnt even work that way, fire 30 rounds, if 15 penetrate then its generally considered to be good.

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23 minutes ago, merlin51 said:

also @30°

PzGr.39 is 48mm @500m @90° and 36mm @500m @30°

Both within enter or spall you territory

S35 is cast armor, Its very hard and i guess you could say very slippery as far as biting into its angles
But it has a downside also, if you get a certain percentage through it, its worse than plain RHA spalling.
So if pak gun gets near the normal spalling area, you probably have big chunks of cast flying around.
 

On the flip side, dont expect every round you fire to go BANG guaranteed XXX penetration
real life doesnt even work that way, fire 30 rounds, if 15 penetrate then its generally considered to be good.

nvm

Well not so nvm I guess - the fact of the matter is that the pak36 we have in the game is way outperforming its historical ability. I mean the penetration tables you are posting are paper penetration figures, the pak36 in this game is killing tanks that even at 100m it should not penetrate. I mean should a pak36 kill my Sherman at 500m frontally or not? Should it kill a stuart at 1200m frontally or not?  Because they are in this game.

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51 minutes ago, stankyus said:

nvm

Well not so nvm I guess - the fact of the matter is that the pak36 we have in the game is way outperforming its historical ability. I mean the penetration tables you are posting are paper penetration figures, the pak36 in this game is killing tanks that even at 100m it should not penetrate. I mean should a pak36 kill my Sherman at 500m frontally or not? Should it kill a stuart at 1200m frontally or not?  Because they are in this game.

No, that part should not be.
Do you know by chance is it AP or HE doing the killing? (that means you have to admit to spawning a pak36 i realize lol)
I think some other players have found that HE might be misbehaving again and did a bug report on it?

edit
 though be careful with stewie.
face should be good with the nice angle at 1200m easily but it has some thin and flat areas
that wont stop much of anything, bush hopping pak gun from an FMS can get you through them
 

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22 hours ago, saronin said:

I’ve heard that. No idea if it’s true or not. 

Changes like this aren't made without notifying the player base. 

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7 hours ago, merlin51 said:

No, that part should not be.
Do you know by chance is it AP or HE doing the killing? (that means you have to admit to spawning a pak36 i realize lol)
I think some other players have found that HE might be misbehaving again and did a bug report on it?

edit
 though be careful with stewie.
face should be good with the nice angle at 1200m easily but it has some thin and flat areas
that wont stop much of anything, bush hopping pak gun from an FMS can get you through them
 

Well the pak36 wtfexploded one of my squaddies churchill3. It punched through thrances stu at 1100m along with Stoney's just prior.  Again one killed thrance at 1200m. It's killed canukplf in his Sherman, me last map twice, one from just over 500m and one finished me off at about 125m frontally in my Sherman. Prior to the buff, the pak36 had to be under 100m with a low flanking shot at the hull under the turret for spall kill on the gunner. I don't recall any issues from the old crew about that performance until they decided to find ways to alieviate some of the Axis t0 tanking issues but even then the pak 36 was not killing shermans up until about two years ago when I lost my first Sherman from one frontally at 450m covering a depot.  

 

There is fudging a little to squeeze out some penetration for balance, I'm ok with some of that. It's wholly a different thing to create a fantasy round and slapping a label on it that has nothing in common with what it actually is. 

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On 13.2.2018 at 4:46 PM, malvoc said:

Lets all just hold hands and agree we need some changes in this game right now its so unbalanced it isn't even fun I can say the weekends have some good fights and weekdays around 5pm EST is awesome sometimes!!!

As for balancing numbers I come to the conclusion its fking impossible you are gonna play where you want and if forced to play somewhere else hell it would even [censored] me off lol!!!

I do not like relying on a few players to run supply for whole game and map I think placing attacks would be ok but the moving supply around sucks and lately we have no HC even on...

Malvoc out....

 

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By the way playing on the winning side for five consecutive campaigns and talking about game balance or implying to care about fairness? Oxymoron much? Rationalisation olympics gold medal. 

Edited by arado234

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7 hours ago, stankyus said:

Well the pak36 wtfexploded one of my squaddies churchill3. It punched through thrances stu at 1100m along with Stoney's just prior.  Again one killed thrance at 1200m. It's killed canukplf in his Sherman, me last map twice, one from just over 500m and one finished me off at about 125m frontally in my Sherman. Prior to the buff, the pak36 had to be under 100m with a low flanking shot at the hull under the turret for spall kill on the gunner. I don't recall any issues from the old crew about that performance until they decided to find ways to alieviate some of the Axis t0 tanking issues but even then the pak 36 was not killing shermans up until about two years ago when I lost my first Sherman from one frontally at 450m covering a depot.  

 

There is fudging a little to squeeze out some penetration for balance, I'm ok with some of that. It's wholly a different thing to create a fantasy round and slapping a label on it that has nothing in common with what it actually is. 

I would like to meet that player that accomplished that with the pak36.

 

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I've killed a couple shermans with the pak36 at over 1k a couple camps ago. But I was firing HE and I believe I hit the commander with the hatch open. I assume that fragments hit the ammo or something.

 

Pretty much pure dumb luck on my part.

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1 hour ago, dre21 said:

I would like to meet that player that accomplished that with the pak36.

 

LOL, Yah NS right?!..  I would not EVEN think about bringing it up at all.  Its the crazy thing to even think about. Sure mb the Stu at close range or from the flank from medium range - but 1200m? frontally?.  Mb the Sherman like in the old days in that very unique situation.  Nope, its been more frequent over the past few years and getting even more ridiculous.  Seriously the Pak36 wtf exploded a squaddies ch3 last map.. I know it sounds loony tunes but yah it happened.  The HE bug was supposed to have been squashed. IF its still around, its much worse.

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On 2/14/2018 at 7:16 PM, Lob12 said:

Didn't they boost the pak36 recently? 

Not recently, but it was done in the past, yes. It's not unique to just this unit, however.

14 hours ago, GVONPAUL said:

Changes like this aren't made without notifying the player base. 

Just to be devil's advocate, maybe they aren't any longer, but this game has a demonstrated history of doing just that with several units - Pak36 sight included. Some others which got unmentioned buffs are the H-39 and German Flak 20mm. Granted this was all a long while ago

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This game once in a while produces "surprising" results.

Like the threads where I mention blowing up Sherms with 2cm HE.

Or, when its darn near impossible to kill a Vicky with 50 or 75 mm PAK, a thread about that as well.

  • So when anything gets blown up at 1200m from a 3,7 cm ATG, I would calk it up on the same account. (the weird things happen account)

 

So why no such reports from axis tankers;

Because what ever Pz is hit, from what ever ATG, from any angle, the axis Pz driver expect to be blown up, and will not notice the above described unusual ammo performance.

edit, just remembered after one of the updated last year, suddenly the 3,7cm PAK would light up the Vickys like they were made out of a gasoline filled baloon.

That NEVER happened before that update.  I firmly believe, by playing the same units for 6+ years, that things do change without the rats telling us.

Intentional or not.

Edited by Hardlead

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39 minutes ago, Lob12 said:

Everything always lit up vickies like they were made out of gasoline filled baloon... 

Can you still flame the Vicky with the rifleman?  I used to do it with them and the LMG especially.. along with the A13 and Cru2.

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