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biggles4

Open City Flag

12 posts in this topic

This is an idea I thought might provide an interesting change of pace to the fighting in game, and possibly be something the Rats could implement relatively easily even with reduced resources. I posted it previously, but couldn't find it in a search. The reason I'm reposting the idea is that it needs terrain dev abilities to be implemented, and it seems CRS is nearing that point.


Physically the idea is to have an exposed capture objective. Instead of a building, there would be something like a low platform, maybe six inches off the ground, fitting the footprint of the average flag building, with a flag in the middle of it. It might even merely be a pavement texture overlaying the ground. You would capture, as per usual, by occupying the platform. Defensive works could be placed around, and perhaps on, the flag area, making it different with each fight.

 
Obviously you could be sniped from any range while capping an open flag and so it might seem a silly idea, but that is actually the point, it would force area control in order to effect capture.

 
One of the game's primary complaints is the leet ninja capture method. One of the proposed solutions is to replace flags with Zones Of Control. Well to capture an open flag requires control of the surrounding area (and even the sky above). Thus an exposed capture space effectively creates a ZOC, but utilizes the current game mechanisms, thus it would be in relatively easy reach development wise. A simple platform and flag is not a complicated model to build, and would probably not even require new textures.


The reason it is proposed that city flags be used is that with depots a spawn is usually next door. It would be impossible to hold an exposed flag against the infantry spawning in the depot, shooting and throwing grenades out the windows. City flags have no spawns.

 
Also there are more than one type of capture building used for the city ingame. Evidently, when map-building, CRS can choose from more than one structure. Thus this idea could probably be tried on a very limited basis - a city flag here or there - in order to see how it plays.

 
Different city flags, with different surroundings would obviously provide different challenges. The city at Tienen is located within a cluster of buildings, and as such is unexposed to direct fire from enemy spawns, therefore it would be a good candidate for this change. It would be a close quarters, house to house fight. No being stuck in the flag building, it could be defended from any of the surrounding structures, which would have to be cleared. Then there is the city at Essen which is right on the corner of a main street. It is exposed for a long distance in more than one direction, but it as well is unexposed to direct spawn fire. This would provide the challenge of controlling a big city sector.


I think the capture of such flags would play more like war and less like cap the flag, and so possibly add to gameplay. In the very least they would add variety to the game. And not being development heavy, they could perhaps be implemented without stressing current resources.

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I think thats a very interesting idea, would be cool to at least test the concept in a few cities and see how it plays out.

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Or another idea i kinda developed from a different post. Make it so the ab isnt cappable until city cp is contested. Timers start on first contest. Put cp timers back to normal. See what happens, gives defenders a 2nd chance to prevent ab from being capped and supply bounced.

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Changing capture points appears to be on the table.

 open places have been suggested but with the new HE audit it could become a hellmare to capture as these would easily be cleaned off

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11 hours ago, Zebbeee said:

Changing capture points appears to be on the table.

 open places have been suggested but with the new HE audit it could become a hellmare to capture as these would easily be cleaned off

Yes! War is hell. Consider it a challenge.

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20 hours ago, choad said:

Or another idea i kinda developed from a different post. Make it so the ab isnt cappable until city cp is contested. Timers start on first contest. Put cp timers back to normal. See what happens, gives defenders a 2nd chance to prevent ab from being capped and supply bounced.

Combine the ideas and you have to exercise control over a city sector in order to cap AB. Seems reasonable to me.

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3 hours ago, biggles4 said:

Combine the ideas and you have to exercise control over a city sector in order to cap AB. Seems reasonable to me.

The problem with that is that they don't have the game set up with city sectors. The idea has been discussed in regards to the major cities. Most towns, though, don't have sectors, and the game wasn't programmed with that kind of terrain breakdown AFAIK.

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6 hours ago, Quincannon said:

The problem with that is that they don't have the game set up with city sectors. The idea has been discussed in regards to the major cities. Most towns, though, don't have sectors, and the game wasn't programmed with that kind of terrain breakdown AFAIK.

Effectively, I mean. Capping an exposed flag requires control of the surrounding area, a sort of effective ZOC, or sector, as it were, but without all the programming.

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Interesting idea.

Have to think on it some more to really try and see some of the implications -but might be good.

Also, could this be used for maybe terrain capture of areas and allowing spawning?

For example, capture a crossroads, or hill top, or bridge?  Then be allowed to spawn infantry there?
Though, maybe not needed, can just put MS up?

 

Edited by delems

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On 4/15/2018 at 9:02 AM, delems said:

Interesting idea.

Have to think on it some more to really try and see some of the implications -but might be good.

Also, could this be used for maybe terrain capture of areas and allowing spawning?

For example, capture a crossroads, or hill top, or bridge?  Then be allowed to spawn infantry there?
Though, maybe not needed, can just put MS up?

 

Yeah, I think the FMS takes care of that. The FMS being set by truck, a very vulnerable unit, also means that one needs to exercise a certain control over the area, or that there is at least no enemy presence, in order to set the spawn. One problem with cap points in the field is that they wouldn't change, whereas FMS' are player placed and so always varying. Imo the best way to take the battle outside the city, would be to make persistent defensive FMS' with persistent PPOS. These would have to be dealt with by attackers before hitting the city, or setting their own FMS'. They'd add variety, and would take the fight into the field.

Not sure how you'd do that, but I seem to remember there being persistent defensive missions back in the days of town-based supply. With persistent defensive missions, FMS' attached to those missions could perhaps persist as well, and so you'd have a sort of defensive front line out in the field. 

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Alltough it sounds interesting to have open cap points to discourage ninja tactics I see the danger that the game would become a world of tanks with some sappers running around.

Infantry fighting in a town now is needed because only infantry can really keep the enemy from capping the city CPs. If you add open cap platforms a tank can defend it just as good or even better than a grunt can. So you'd bring even more tanks and less infantry on the defense. Vice versa you need less ability to kill EI and more ATGs on the attack so the attackers would bring way less infantry themselves.

In result you would see less combined warfare and not more of it. I wouldn't like that.

edit: Of course that doesn't mean it won't be interesting to add SOME of those cap points here and there to simulate a more tank driven battle for an area (like a hill or bridge) rather than a town.

 

Edited by vanapo
addition

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