BLKHWK8

Changes scheduled for Friday's Maintenance 4/20/18

94 posts in this topic

11 hours ago, crashzzz said:

Xcas Allied have lost 5 maps in a row and are losing this one as well. Not sure why you’re complaining. Sorry winning this campaign isn’t coming easy enough for you. (not) 

What I've noticed over the years is this. The losing team loses because they give up. TZ3 is a real problem (it's effects are demoralizing). The key to winning is to demoralize the other side, not defeat them. Serious errors by HC can put a campaign into a death spiral (demoralized again). Perceived unfair weakness in your weapons kit is demoralizing. CRS is trying but it takes time and confounding all their efforts is a demoralized PB.

A  demoralized playerbase is not a good model for success. As each of us logs due to this, the negative impact on game play becomes exponential. A very difficult situation that all game companies face.

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36 minutes ago, bmw said:

For god sakes, before we all start whining about it..........how about we give it a try and see how it goes. 

And miss a chance to make our daily pointless rants with no arguments except that "it was better when it was before"? NEVAAAAAH U HEAR ME? NEEVAAAAAAA!

 

 

 

 

Yeah let's see how it goes. Can't be worse than before.

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Double penalty?  MB some of you should go re-read Merlins post.  The bonus and penalty is not two separate things, they are one in the same that is sliding on a population scale.

B<----------------[0% cap time adjustment 0%]---------------->B

OP<------[+25% cap time adjustment -25%]------------------>UP

UP<-----------------------[-50% cap time adjustment +50%]->OP

The scaling bracket is the same.  That bracket has to be played around with to find a good  balance.

 

 

The next step would be a scaling system that deals with total population to refine the scaling bracket for all timezone population shifts.

Total Pop = 50

B: Side A:25<------------------------[Max Timer cap timer = 6ppl + Cap time adjustment 0%]----------------------------> Side B:25

OP: Side A:35<----[Max Cap timer = 6ppl + cap time adjustment + Cap time adjustment +50%]-------------------> Side B:15

UP: Side A:35<----[Max Cap timer = 6ppl + cap time adjustment + Cap time adjustment -50%]--------------------> Side B:15

Total Pop = 24

B: Side A:12<------------------------[Max Timer cap timer = 3ppl + Cap time adjustment 0%]----------------------------> Side B:12

OP: Side A:18<----[Max Cap timer = 3ppl + cap time adjustment + Cap time adjustment +50%]--------------------> Side B:6

UP: Side A:18<----[Max Cap timer = 3ppl + cap time adjustment + Cap time adjustment -50%]---------------------> Side B:6

 

This is assuming that the Max cap timer is 4 minutes.

Pop lower than 15 Max Cap timer speed is achievable with 2 ppl in the cp + Cap time adjustment.  That means that if you are 2:1 OP the max speed 2 ppl can cap a cp is 6 minutes and the Max if you are UP is 2 minutes.

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23 minutes ago, stankyus said:

Double penalty?

SD + Timer penalty = Double penalty

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2 hours ago, Sudden said:

What I've noticed over the years is this. The losing team loses because they give up. TZ3 is a real problem (it's effects are demoralizing). The key to winning is to demoralize the other side, not defeat them. Serious errors by HC can put a campaign into a death spiral (demoralized again). Perceived unfair weakness in your weapons kit is demoralizing. CRS is trying but it takes time and confounding all their efforts is a demoralized PB.

A  demoralized playerbase is not a good model for success. As each of us logs due to this, the negative impact on game play becomes exponential. A very difficult situation that all game companies face.

This is exactly what makes WWIIOL a double-edged sword. 

 

There is nothing else in the gaming world that comes close to capturing the morale effects of warfare.  It simultaneously makes the game special while making the game its own worst enemy.  

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3 minutes ago, Capco said:

This is exactly what makes WWIIOL a double-edged sword. 

 

There is nothing else in the gaming world that comes close to capturing the morale effects of warfare.  It simultaneously makes the game special while making the game its own worst enemy.  

Capco is dead on with his statement.

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20 minutes ago, sydspain said:

SD + Timer penalty = Double penalty

Rgr that, I can see your POV.  I don't like SD that much with the exception that I see more the benefit of it than the Axis do being that I am a low pop allied player.  However for me, I see SD as a part of the whole at the moment to help the underpop side.. I have always maintained that dynamic cap timers where the only way to deal with cap timers period. It did not matter how they adjusted cap timers if they where adjusted across the board it did nothing to of relief to the low pop side. I really never thought we would see them for ages, but like everything else it takes time to see what new things bring and how to properly adjust them to the game. 

I still think my point stands for the time being - this is a new dynamic cap timer and we have no way of knowing much of anything about the effects it has outside of it slowing down the map. Certainly not enough to know if we need to OR CAN eliminate the SD. It certainly has not stopped the Axis OP from capping towns in TZ3 which it shouldn't, but it has stopped the TZ3 15-20 rolls up to this point.   I think the Allied problem is more symptomatic and don't foresee much of a change what so ever until CRS decides to change things up a bit balance wise. ONLY until then you all might see more balanced numbers where all the SD and Cap timer penalties wont interfere with your ability to get in the game without a handicap interfering.  That being said, mb, just mb a there is a balancing system which IMO should include move timers, supply trickle timers with dynamic cap timers could eliminate the need for SD. I think the potential is there but I cannot say for sure and I don't think anyone can.  The addition of dynamic cap timers is a real gem in the right direction, they just need time to figure it out. I think the end goal is to get rid of SD while providing other dynamics that act as game leveling mechanisms for OP and Low Pop. 

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45 minutes ago, Capco said:

This is exactly what makes WWIIOL a double-edged sword. 

 

There is nothing else in the gaming world that comes close to capturing the morale effects of warfare.  It simultaneously makes the game special while making the game its own worst enemy.  

Agree, this is why there should be very special attention to having a rule set for balancing equipment.  There is perceived imbalance and there is factual imbalance.  ITs a fact the Matty is the best tank in its teir so there are few. Its a fact the Tiger is the best in its teir - yet there are many. That is a factual imbalance.  I don't think the allied infantry kit is superior to the Axis infantry kit. You could go by a weapon by weapon basis and you wont find it superior, if anything you would find a conservative answer as equal or less than equal. However we have less infantry still division per division.  That is not lost on the allied pb, its not a perceived imbalance. Its a real imbalance and we play with that fact knowing that the game is stacked in that area among others. It does not mean when I get on I don't fight like hell and try to outfight my opponent, it just gets very old and frustrating that you have little answers to big problems over and over again. So you log in less, and log out earlier.  I don't mind losing, I do mind losing to a stacked deck to being outnumbered, outgunned, and out supplied.

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11 hours ago, OHM said:

The Balance timers have been in place the whole campaign, We did not touch the settings  this at this time. They are just being reposted.

 

Maintenance is done and the new Capture timers are now in place

"did not touch the settings..."

"new Capture timers are now in place" 

?? which one is it ??

Did u adjust the capture timers or not ?

CRS is on the right path and dedication is there for sure...however, you should never ever make adjustments like this during a campaign

Let it play out, then adjust....never do it during campaign...it really ticks people off after putting in much effort and time to see it adjusted during a campaign....dont do it

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6 minutes ago, kazee said:

"did not touch the settings..."

"new Capture timers are now in place" 

?? which one is it ??

Did u adjust the capture timers or not ?

CRS is on the right path and dedication is there for sure...however, you should never ever make adjustments like this during a campaign

Let it play out, then adjust....never do it during campaign...it really ticks people off after putting in much effort and time to see it adjusted during a campaign....dont do it

Read the first post again. Even population timers were changed. 

Edited by gretnine
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B<----------------------------------0--------------------------------->B
                                           [POP]

 

As working now

50% unbalance
UP<----------------------------------0--------------------------------->OP
                         [-Timer%       POP     +Timer%]

 

As would work if the disparity was not shared across both sides

50% unbalance
UP<----------------------------------0--------------------------------->OP
           [-Timer%                     POP  Timer 0%]

Now you have too much on one side
OP has normal cap time, but UP is literally running in and kicking the table, instacap or close to it
Rather than help UP,  you got supermen which you don't want either.

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18 minutes ago, gretnine said:

Read the first post again. Even population timers were changed. 

So they did make adjustments mid-campaign ?

Sorry but you should never change the rules during the campaign itself, you don't do that to people

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2 minutes ago, kazee said:

So they did make adjustments mid-campaign ?

Sorry but you should never change the rules during the campaign itself, you don't do that to people

You are assuming this campaign was going to end some day?

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10 minutes ago, sydspain said:

You are assuming this campaign was going to end some day?

Haha, yes it will end some day.

I just think you dont make changes like this mid-campaign, nor any patches mid-campaign unless for maintenance. Just old school philosophy i guess but i have seen many patches released mid-campaign that pop up new bugs, plus you should never change the rules during a campaign. Just mho

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12 minutes ago, kazee said:

So they did make adjustments mid-campaign ?

Sorry but you should never change the rules during the campaign itself, you don't do that to people

The rules remain the same, the times to execute them.has changed slightly. War is always unpredictable.

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So long as the axis don't try to cap Antwerp everything will be OK.

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14 minutes ago, BLKHWK8 said:

The rules remain the same, the times to execute them.has changed slightly. War is always unpredictable.

Well you guys can paint it with any brush you want however there were adjustments, changes to cap times, and or rule changes...whatever u want to call them, but the picture remains the same...it was done mid-campaign and imho should not ever happen during a campaign.

And also after reading the email i just received;  the supply reinstatement for a unit kia was increased from 12 hours to 15 hours ??

I am not complaining, just trying to offer advice...do this stuff after a campaign...nor am i mad, just abit disappointed that this wasn't really even discussed with all parties ?? 

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2 hours ago, stankyus said:

Agree, this is why there should be very special attention to having a rule set for balancing equipment.  There is perceived imbalance and there is factual imbalance.  ITs a fact the Matty is the best tank in its teir so there are few. Its a fact the Tiger is the best in its teir - yet there are many. That is a factual imbalance.  I don't think the allied infantry kit is superior to the Axis infantry kit. You could go by a weapon by weapon basis and you wont find it superior, if anything you would find a conservative answer as equal or less than equal. However we have less infantry still division per division.  That is not lost on the allied pb, its not a perceived imbalance. Its a real imbalance and we play with that fact knowing that the game is stacked in that area among others. It does not mean when I get on I don't fight like hell and try to outfight my opponent, it just gets very old and frustrating that you have little answers to big problems over and over again. So you log in less, and log out earlier.  I don't mind losing, I do mind losing to a stacked deck to being outnumbered, outgunned, and out supplied.

I think when you compare the armor lists for balance, it is a mistake to just compare the number of tanks against other tanks in the supply lists.

Many tanks  (including Tigers) die ro ATGs and EA too.  For example the DB-7 has about 500 axis armor kills this campaign. (It is almost a flying tank lol).  The axis side has nothing comparable to that in terms of armor kill results

Also the allies can spawn a much better atg from their MS.  The axis small  atg is not very good against late tier allied tanks.

So there may be some other reasons to add a few extra tigers to the spawn list because of these other advantages the allues have.

I know Axis have some unique and  nice weapon systems too like the 88 and the HE-111.   But my point is you need to look at the entirety of things that are actually killing armor on thebattlefield and balance the equipment lists based on everything.

cheers!

Edited by krazydog
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25 minutes ago, krazydog said:

I think when you compare the armor lists for balance, it is a mistake to just compare the number of tanks against other tanks in the supply lists.

Many tanks  (including Tigers) die ro ATGs and EA too.  For example the DB-7 has about 500 axis armor kills this campaign. (It is almost a flying tank lol).  The axis side has nothing comparable to that in terms of armor kill results

Also the allies can spawn a much better atg from their MS.  The axis small  atg is not very good against late tier allied tanks.

So there may be some other reasons to add a few extra tigers to the spawn list because of these other advantages the allues have.

I know Axis have some unique and  nice weapon systems too like the 88 and the HE-111.   But my point is you need to look at the entirety of things that are actually killing armor on thebattlefield and balance the equipment lists based on everything.

cheers!

 

If we extended the arbitrary rules used in T2/3 into T0, we would have as many Matties as you have 4Ds plus a few extra to make up for the lack of a TD for the stugB.  Why do we get less infantry.. because of a db7?  does not compute.

 

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2 hours ago, krazydog said:

Also the allies can spawn a much better atg from their MS.  The axis small  atg is not very good against late tier allied tanks.

Um, what? The only one that is worth it's salt is the 2lbr. But tgat is just from Brit brigs. The 25 is a POS, absolutely worthless. Not even sure what the point of it being in game is .... hehe.

The pak you can spawn does quite well against tanks so far as i can tell. Will check stats to see if i am off base there.

Pretty much disagree with your overall assessmentas well.

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3 hours ago, sydspain said:

You are assuming this campaign was going to end some day?

it's been going for a while - but it's far from the longest

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39 minutes ago, choad said:

The 25 is a POS, absolutely worthless. Not even sure what the point of it being in game is

Well in T0 and into T1, it isnt so bad.
Small light easy to move and hide had good rate of fire and ok penetration under 500m
So if you are mostly stopping PZIIc PZIIf PZIVd. it is not so bad, better than the 37mm lobber on the R35.

After that it's value kind of tanks but still it can have it's uses, and a lot of axis armor is still vulnerable to it on a close flank shot.

 

3 hours ago, kazee said:

it was done mid-campaign and imho should not ever happen during a campaign.

2 camps of thought on that
One like you agrees that you should not try a mid camp change.
The other one thinks, just make the change and we will deal with it.

Either side could be right i guess depending on what kind of change you are looking at.
 

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24 minutes ago, merlin51 said:

just make the change and we will deal with it.

There will always be a campaign after this one.;)

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49 minutes ago, merlin51 said:

Well in T0 and into T1, it isnt so bad.
Small light easy to move and hide had good rate of fire and ok penetration under 500m
So if you are mostly stopping PZIIc PZIIf PZIVd. it is not so bad, better than the 37mm lobber on the R35.

After that it's value kind of tanks but still it can have it's uses, and a lot of axis armor is still vulnerable to it on a close flank shot.

 

Well i guess. Tier 0 and tier 1 lasted something like 3 days and 4 days respectively  if i recall. Seems so long ago, but since then they are essentially "worthless" IMO. So they had a whole 1 week of respectable utility! 

;)

The 25 mm has terrible stats, and when you compare it to the pak36 it is no contest.

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