malvoc

Biggest cut off and comeback ever

107 posts in this topic

7 minutes ago, chaoswzkd said:

I mean, are you serious? If you disagree with a politician, the only possible recourse is to kidnap their children and threaten them until they change their mind? That's basically what you're saying.

 

Here's a pretty simple alternative: "CRS, I know you want what's best for the game to be healthy, because that is what is going to keep the game alive, and what makes you the most money, and what you're passionate about. I also want to enjoy this game and see it thrive. Here are some issues I've identified that are a direct threat to that, and here are the reasons why I think these issues are threats. Please respond ASAP so myself and the community know you are at least aware of this, and whether you agree or disagree that they are issues. If they are issues, please fix as soon as you are able. Thank you."

 

You could do that. It's real simple.

I understand that there's a point of "enough is enough", and a lot of Allies are saying that they're at that point. But it's seriously starting to become a trend. "Fix TZ3 issues or we all unsub and ruin the game", "Fix supply issues or we all unsub and ruin the game", "'Fix' Axis LMG or we all unsub and ruin the game", etc.

Meanwhile, Axis has had long-standing grievances that greatly affect gameplay. There's a one-sided air war for the past I don't even know how many campaigns that completely devastated Axis pilot population. The Allies still have extremely superior SMGs. Etc. And there have absolutely been Axis players that have threatened to unsub. But it hasn't been almost all of them, or almost all of their leadership, or their squads, or etc. 

It's becoming very worrying, because it's becoming a trend for Allied players to do this, and worse, CRS is responding every time. How long is it until most of Axis throws a campaign, and then says "fix the air war or we all unsub and ruin the game"?

 

I'm not criticising the issue you guys have been talking about. They're legitimate, they need attention. But this attitude of "What else can I do but get all my buddies and hold a gun to their head?" is both wrong and EXTREMELY concerning.

 

The Axis Whine Brigade. Have you heard that term? You should have. Why? Because they invented the idea of threatening to unsub if they didn't get what they wanted. And it usually worked for them. 

But again... I'm not unsubbing and I'm not going to stop supporting the cause. I'm just tired of the same thing happening over and over and over and NOT BEING FIXED until someone points it out over and over to the Rats. 

It shouldn't happen in the first place. But, it most def shouldn't happen over and over. 

I'm done. See you guys soon. 

bye

Edited by lipton

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*** the fact 1 town links every thing in the north is messed up.  Axis are lucky to not have a set up like that

Guess you missed the Antwerp, Kalm, Roos, Willem, Moerd, Dord N cut that is done nearly every map?  Resulting in entire N cut.

In fact, I'd be willing to bet axis has had their N cut more times than allies...??

 

Sure, sometimes axis pushed back, and it makes sense to cut the N as we have lost ground. But how many times do allies just run 2 flags N for a couple hours and end the Zees?

And it isn't just one town... there's eeklo, zelzate, stekene, etc.

 

Edited by delems

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40 minutes ago, chaoswzkd said:

I mean, are you serious? If you disagree with a politician, the only possible recourse is to kidnap their children and threaten them until they change their mind? That's basically what you're saying.

I think if you disagree with a politician -  you either vote against him/her - or in the event that you disagree with their opponent more (2 bad choices) you probably wind up staying home and not voting. I don't get how opting not to take part in the game is akin to kidnapping a politicians child .... I think that is a bridge too far my friend.

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26 minutes ago, delems said:

*** the fact 1 town links every thing in the north is messed up.  Axis are lucky to not have a set up like that

Guess you missed the Antwerp, Kalm, Roos, Willem, Moerd, Dord N cut that is done nearly every map?  Resulting in entire N cut.

In fact, I'd be willing to bet axis has had their N cut more times than allies...??

 

Sure, sometimes axis pushed back, and it makes to cut the N as we have lost ground. But how many times do allies just run 2 flags N for a couple hours and end the Zees?

And it isn't just one town... there's eeklo, zelzate, stekene, etc.

 

Really? you list 6 towns that would perform a cut off.

Axis could cap towns on the river to twerp, never touching a single town north of twerp... get to Maldgem and cut off the whole north map from Bresken, vliss and the whole east from there. 

so ya i see how that is the same as a 6 town cut

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There is another factor I'm not going to get into because this is not the place, but had a major impact to the allied side trying to cut Axis N push.

However AHC had made a major mistake which a week  prior to Axis working the cut off. I could see it being a serious issue and one that has been done several times in the past.  I had discussed with the AHC at the time and had told them that while we had momentum we had to spend it going N and not east.  One of our squad HCs agreed (not naming names) but he is a superb map mover and had moved supply just to have it redistributed when he logged out to go east.  AHC has to recognize that the Hasselt/Paal area has to be secured and trade east runs to expand the center N of the hasselt.  GHC has no other real option (apart from OP) but to get in front of the Hasselt Paal area or risk being cut off.  Though I was not ignored by AHC and told we would work it, I think success aided in tunnel vision to the east.  When I logged back in and saw we had taken Frankfurt it was too late to deal with it and TBH, I figured we would retain enough OP to capitalize even though the danger was plain to see. For me at least.

The major second mistake was not getting in front of the North run around... you have to get IN FRONT of the break out and its ok to lose territory to do that.  Getting infront of a break out and stopping it is IMHO just as much moral impact on the opposing side as taking towns.  THEN you work to beat back or cut the break out and still retain your numbers.  Numbers is what we had as our only advantage and it got wasted.

The third issue at hand true or untrue the RDP bombing going on SEEMED not to be hurting Axis supply.  We moved more supply during the peak RDP with hit and run attacks in the same region to eat up Axis Tiger supply just to come back an hour or two later to find 4-5 more tigers decimating our tank supply again and again and again. We where counting how many Tigers got destroyed, and IMHO the attacks where being pulled too soon and not attriting properly. That could be a reason to why it was not working out as we hoped it would.. but also in AHCs defense a good portion of that was the PB was moving on.. and primarily due to and I know it sounds like old hat but because the tigers where decimating the few ppl willing to tank anymore.

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24 minutes ago, ch0ad said:

I think if you disagree with a politician -  you either vote against him/her - or in the event that you disagree with their opponent more (2 bad choices) you probably wind up staying home and not voting. I don't get how opting not to take part in the game is akin to kidnapping a politicians child .... I think that is a bridge too far my friend.

While I will agree that a kidnapped child is far more worrying than unsubscribing, I would contest that "I'm not going to vote for you" is not as much of a problem as "I'm going to leave and take a bunch of my friends and comrades with me so we ruin the game unless you change it."

The example I used was to associate the inherent threat being made. It's not just "I disagree", or "I strongly feel about these issues", but actively making threats and the attitude that the only way to do anything is to make threats.

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1 hour ago, softserve said:

 

On a side note..... can we fix the Maldgem issue lol

the fact 1 town links every thing in the north is messed up.  Axis are lucky to not have a set up like that

I thought this was fixed some time ago. @SCKING can you verify

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13 minutes ago, stankyus said:

There is another factor I'm not going to get into because this is not the place, but had a major impact to the allied side trying to cut Axis N push.

However AHC had made a major mistake which a week  prior to Axis working the cut off. I could see it being a serious issue and one that has been done several times in the past.  I had discussed with the AHC at the time and had told them that while we had momentum we had to spend it going N and not east.  One of our squad HCs agreed (not naming names) but he is a superb map mover and had moved supply just to have it redistributed when he logged out to go east.  AHC has to recognize that the Hasselt/Paal area has to be secured and trade east runs to expand the center N of the hasselt.  GHC has no other real option (apart from OP) but to get in front of the Hasselt Paal area or risk being cut off.  Though I was not ignored by AHC and told we would work it, I think success aided in tunnel vision to the east.  When I logged back in and saw we had taken Frankfurt it was too late to deal with it and TBH, I figured we would retain enough OP to capitalize even though the danger was plain to see. For me at least.

The major second mistake was not getting in front of the North run around... you have to get IN FRONT of the break out and its ok to lose territory to do that.  Getting infront of a break out and stopping it is IMHO just as much moral impact on the opposing side as taking towns.  THEN you work to beat back or cut the break out and still retain your numbers.  Numbers is what we had as our only advantage and it got wasted.

The third issue at hand true or untrue the RDP bombing going on SEEMED not to be hurting Axis supply.  We moved more supply during the peak RDP with hit and run attacks in the same region to eat up Axis Tiger supply just to come back an hour or two later to find 4-5 more tigers decimating our tank supply again and again and again. We where counting how many Tigers got destroyed, and IMHO the attacks where being pulled too soon and not attriting properly. That could be a reason to why it was not working out as we hoped it would.. but also in AHCs defense a good portion of that was the PB was moving on.. and primarily due to and I know it sounds like old hat but because the tigers where decimating the few ppl willing to tank anymore.

All good points.

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14 minutes ago, BLKHWK8 said:

I thought this was fixed some time ago. @SCKING can you verify

Still not fixed with another link to the zee area. Mald still is the linking supply town to the north map.

As this breakout shows, they went Mald first then did the south to Loan cut

If Mald did not cut off the north axis would of had to have redone the move. That cut needed to get MAld to secure the north, If Mald did nothing then the moves would of been very different

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*** Still not fixed with another link to the zee area. Mald still is the linking supply town to the north map.

You can't see ALL the towns axis has to take before we ever come near Mald?  Really?

Your problem wasn't and isn't Mald, it's allowing axis the 10 towns prior to that, including Gent.

 

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39 minutes ago, BLKHWK8 said:

All good points.

None of these are good points and none make any sense.

he talks about going N or East when the direction of the Allied advance was NE anyway.

he talks about getting in front of the N run around when the Axis are already behind you its not possible to be in front.

he talks of little effect of RDP when we had already lost Frankfurt we were on 18hour timers and then it went to 24hrs with RDP

 

Fact is -

Yes its the biggest cut off and comeback ever. Axis have come back from Frankfurt and Koln before but never both.

Yes its the biggest cut off ever - once before Allied entire army was cut off but not with so many towns white flagged.

Edited by actonman

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Delems, i understand what Axis had to do and did. 

Bold move on there part and props to pulling it off.

If pointing out a massive flaw in the supply line that the Axis do not have, is side bais, well ok then 

If taken 10 towns get you to 1 town that now gives you 30 towns is a good idea. then i do not know how to show it to you that you will understand

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8 minutes ago, delems said:

*** Still not fixed with another link to the zee area. Mald still is the linking supply town to the north map.

You can't see ALL the towns axis has to take before we ever come near Mald?  Really?

Your problem wasn't and isn't Mald, it's allowing axis the 10 towns prior to that, including Gent.

 

Lets not limit the current issue with what Maldigem actually is.  Its one of a kind on the entire map though not recognized of its importance by and large with the run of the mill player.

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You know, to put this in perspective:

   -  It's a 1 in a 150+ occurrence.

   -  Lots of things needed to fall the right way for it to happen.

   -  Variability makes the game fun in the long run, predicability does not.

   -  'New' people don't remember 'old' mistakes - nothing like experience.

   -  if the axis cutoff hadn't worked, it would have been a major failure and the the axis would be gnashing their teeth and the allies would be rejoicing.

   - I am sure the Rats will make some changes as needed.

So, it was fun, there were some epic battles, and it will be campaign for the history books.  What more can you really ask for?  

Now, get your big boy pants on and go kill each other!! S!

Edited by GrAnit
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5 minutes ago, BLKHWK8 said:

@merlin51 can you see if this is an item being fixed with terraign?

Afaik, the only way to "fix" the Maldegem issue is to provide a link from a Zeeland port to another port that is connected to the factories.

 

The "problem" with that is that it creates a way to leapfrog down the Channel coast from the Zeeland port which has the new link.

 

The most obvious choice for the new link would be in Vlissingen imo.  By linking Vlissingen to Oostende (for example), Maldegem is no longer a cut off point.  

 

Any new link would require a new CP building, and I'm not sure if that's a terrain thing or not.  

Edited by Capco

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Just now, merlin51 said:

What is the actual issue?

That's another valid question.  Is the Maldegem cut off point actually an issue?  

 

In my example above, by adding a new link you are basically kicking the can down the road... or in this case, kicking the cut off point down the Channel lol.  

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24 minutes ago, Capco said:

That's another valid question.  Is the Maldegem cut off point actually an issue?  

 

In my example above, by adding a new link you are basically kicking the can down the road... or in this case, kicking the cut off point down the Channel lol.  

It would, however its been a while since I looked at it. IIRC the answer was not to add another supply link to Mald but 2 supply links... don't kill me if I am wrong but one to Helle and one to Westkapela which eliminated the Maldigem cut. I'm not sure why this was poo poo'd but I think it had to do with not being able to add stuff at the time.  Its been that long since it was last discussed that I can remember.

 

EDIT: Something struck me also, I think the Helle link was not on the table since Helle was uncappable.

EDIT 2: I think Westkapella was also poo poo'd because it opened up England.  That's what I get for trying to remember.

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5 hours ago, dre21 said:

Yeah but you guys let a lonely Sapper :) bounce your Air out of Cambrai, 

That was the longest 3 min before the radio went hot till I capped it and bounced it. Before that you guys were spawning planes like an angry hornets nest. But not one thought about spawning an INF to check the AF bunker , and at that time we held the spawnable in Cambrai and my FMS had been harrassing the AF for almost an hour before we even AOed the town . 

only took you by yourself 3 mins to cap?

 

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Maldegem is the final town to link to the Zeelands from the south.. We have plans in the future to expand the map, but until then, this won’t change. 

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4 hours ago, redoak84 said:

Bye! Don’t come back to soon. Personally, I find it pathetic how people are always threatening to unsubscribe. Bunch of spoiled brats. Don’t like what you are paying for then leave. Oh, and thanks for diminishing the axis efforts by attributing it to the Americans shortage of semi-automatics as the root cause. Never mind the British and French units we fought, plus the British tank discrepancies. Us axis just suck and are incapable of overcoming odds fairly you know. 

you got that right

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Just now, SCKING said:

Maldegem is the final town to link to the Zeelands from the south.. We have plans in the future to expand the map, but until then, this won’t change. 

Yah... I believe that was the old answer also. Its starting to come back to me piecemeal. The answer to Mald was the addition of another town to split the link to the Zees and was not going to happen for a long time.

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Do you guys Really want to know why this Happen on this map.??    Because of ME... ME... ME.. ME.... !!!      No other officer would have stayed  on 2 days in a row   with 12hrs Moic 1st day and 18hrs the next day....   When i took 3rd pz  and started shoving it west..    EVERYONE started freaking out!  OFFICERS were getting mad that they would get cut off.. Players scream at how stupid i am (thx delems)      My superior officers were concerned, and i then had to explain exactly how  the ops would happen.  Fiambre then "ok" 3.3 and 3.2 to go for maldegem..Fiambre realized that we were only risking 2 units in training. when we got towards gent  and NO.. NOT 1 ALLIED UNIT HAD FALL BACK.... and the Risk of cut off was removed.. the rest of 3rd was given to me and started to slide forward.... 2pz then came in and held the back...   we get maldegem.. and gent.... So I  go to bed... wake up   NO UNITS MOVED BACK....  2nd mega big mistake by allied.... 2ndPz  was in brussels... South i went... and with the success the day before my Tman gave me the full go at 2nd down to Laon.. and he help with brigade move as i was busy with AO oic ...     

 

  So if you look up Who put the AO on each of the towns in the cut.. IT WAS ME...  all units moved  in the cut ..IT WAS ME...   

 FOR 33 DAYS BEFORE THIS HAPPEN  EVERYTHING IN GAME WAS JUST FINE.......    THE ONLY FACTOR THAT CHANGES WAS I HAD VISION AND A GOAL... I NEED TO SAY THIS OVER AND OVER.... I COULD NEVER.. AND I MEAN NEVER... COULD HAVE DONE THIS WITHOUT THE PLAYERS....  SO MANY PLAYERS WENT ABOVE AND BEYOND THE CALL OF DUTY .  ALL THE GUYS THAT DROVE AROUND TOWNS TO BUST THE FB'S  TO STAY AHEAD OF THE ATTACK.. TO THE PILOTS WHO FLEW AND LANDED AND FLEW US TO THE NEXT TARGETS...    I NEED A SPECIAL THANKS  TO THE "250" SQUAD...  OVER AND OVER THEY PROVE HOW VALUED THEY ARE!!! 

 

 SO to wrap this up .. STOP BLAMING EVERYTHING ELSE IN THIS GAME...   Allied got out played by the ENTIRE AXIS players!!!   I just was Leading it!!

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