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goreblimey

TIER 1 armour BALANCE need looking at

185 posts in this topic

3 minutes ago, nugx said:

there could be a situation where 5 guys in matildas approaching a town would meet a tiger

Not possible.
The tiger would fall asleep or die of old age before 5 matildas got that far.

If 5 matilda do come upon a tiger, their new tactic better be to remain silent, seek cover, and radio the tigers position and activities to others.
Because while the matilda might survive a few baddly angled hits from the tiger, it isnt going to survive square hits unless it's maybe 2km away
And it wont be able to outrun it, even if it is 2km away
And the only way its going to kill the tiger is if one of them can shove their gun up the tigers tail pipe.

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1 hour ago, merlin51 said:

Not possible.
The tiger would fall asleep or die of old age before 5 matildas got that far.

If 5 matilda do come upon a tiger, their new tactic better be to remain silent, seek cover, and radio the tigers position and activities to others.
Because while the matilda might survive a few baddly angled hits from the tiger, it isnt going to survive square hits unless it's maybe 2km away
And it wont be able to outrun it, even if it is 2km away
And the only way its going to kill the tiger is if one of them can shove their gun up the tigers tail pipe.

 

You have to take also the whole system in account at this moment Merlin - the players in 'matilda' would have it for free, while the player in the 'tiger' played a lot to get the points to purchase it, and he would have only a few uses of it.

At this point there is another factor - psychological, matildas don't have anything to lose, while the tiger player, a lot.

Edited by nugx

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8 minutes ago, nugx said:

psychological, matildas don't have anything to lose, while the tiger player, a lot.

from a 2pdr?
not much to lose there.
maybe if they got littlejohn adapters.

I'd be more worried in a tiger if a pack of Laffly W15TCC's came flying over a hill, those could actually hurt me

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1 hour ago, merlin51 said:

from a 2pdr?
not much to lose there.
maybe if they got littlejohn adapters.

I'd be more worried in a tiger if a pack of Laffly W15TCC's came flying over a hill, those could actually hurt me

I mean overall, a bomb from a plane or anti-armor inf weapon and the tiger player is back to the free pz3, while matildas wait to run into the town - combined arms ops,  inf-armor-air force, how it should be.

 

There would be plenty of other scenarios, ofcourse the 'higher tier' the earlier purchased the less of those tanks/planes there would be, meaning it would be a rare situation where players in the free tank, get stopped by someone - and if they do, call for help from air force - just like in real life.

'Pilots we need you to kill that 1 tank and we roll into town !!!'

Edited by nugx

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In other way,  one could think of this system this way:

Every player has the potential to get his '5 minutes' of briliance once he purchases the 'better' armament - but that will end once someone blows you up, repeating the process.

Edited by nugx

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16 minutes ago, nugx said:

In other way,  one could think of this system this way:

Every player has the potential to get his '5 minutes' of briliance once he purchases the 'better' armament - but that will end once someone blows you up, repeating the process.

Errrrmmmm.... What are you talking about mate?

"purchases the better armament" "5 minutes of brilliance" I am lost...

Is this a new suggestion perhaps?

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1 hour ago, kase250 said:

Errrrmmmm.... What are you talking about mate?

"purchases the better armament" "5 minutes of brilliance" I am lost...

Is this a new suggestion perhaps?

 

I'll give you example:

Game starts in 1939, you manage to have some very good sorties and in 1940 you purchase a tiger from 1942 for the points you saved up (let's say the game gives you 3 uses of the tiger).

A tiger in 1940 would be better, then what rest of the players have - but if you die 3 times in that tiger, you go back to rest of the players from 1940 in their free tanks.

And this process repeat ad infinitum - when you are back in 1940 with everyone else on their free tanks, you save up again to purchase a better gear.

 

The points could also serve to purchase depleted armament, instead of purchasing 'better' gear. For example:

All players used up the 'free' tanks from 1940, so instead of buying 'better' gear for high price - you can purchase more uses of the same gear for lower price. (untill the re-supply)

 

This gives a lot of tactical options for every player.

What tier I want to purchase? Do i want to save up for 3 uses of tiger?  Or I want to purchase 10 uses of PZ4 ?   Or i want to purchase 50 uses of pz3 in 1940 that is depleted ?

 

rH0McIy.png

 

 

Edited by nugx

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9 minutes ago, nugx said:

 

I'll give you example:

Game starts in 1939, you manage to have some very good sorties and in 1940 you purchase a tiger from 1942 for the points you saved up (let's say the game gives you 3 uses of the tiger).

A tiger in 1940 would be better, then what rest of the players have - but if you die 3 times in that tiger, you go back to rest of the players from 1940 in their free tanks.

And this process repeat ad infinitum - when you are back in 1940 with everyone else on their free tanks, you save up again to purchase a better gear.

 

The points could also serve to purchase depleted armament, instead of purchasing 'better' gear. For example: All players used up the 'free' tanks from 1940, so instead of buying 'better' gear for high price - you can purchase

more uses of the same gear for lower price.

 

 

 

Ok, I got the point... but do you know about Tier cycles?

Basically, we have factories who does  Research cylces and when the cycle finish we advance to a new tier. We dont have "years" etc. 

Your new system could be nice for a new game though.

 

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56 minutes ago, kase250 said:

Ok, I got the point... but you do you know about Tier cycles?

Basically, we have factories who does  Research cylces and when the cycle finish we advance to a new tier. We dont have "years" etc.

If could be nice for a new game though.

 

 

 

It seems Rats are planning 'years'.

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While your at  it you could buy gold ammunition too LOL

nugx , why are you hiding behind this name come out whoever you are......cos noone is going to take you seriously with an account that  NEVER plays.

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2 hours ago, nugx said:

 

I'll give you example:

Game starts in 1939, you manage to have some very good sorties and in 1940 you purchase a tiger from 1942 for the points you saved up (let's say the game gives you 3 uses of the tiger).

A tiger in 1940 would be better, then what rest of the players have - but if you die 3 times in that tiger, you go back to rest of the players from 1940 in their free tanks.

And this process repeat ad infinitum - when you are back in 1940 with everyone else on their free tanks, you save up again to purchase a better gear.

 

The points could also serve to purchase depleted armament, instead of purchasing 'better' gear. For example:

All players used up the 'free' tanks from 1940, so instead of buying 'better' gear for high price - you can purchase more uses of the same gear for lower price. (untill the re-supply)

 

This gives a lot of tactical options for every player.

What tier I want to purchase? Do i want to save up for 3 uses of tiger?  Or I want to purchase 10 uses of PZ4 ?   Or i want to purchase 50 uses of pz3 in 1940 that is depleted ?

 

rH0McIy.png

 

 

We have no plans on turning this into what is essentially a pay to win/loot box style game. 

Putting late war equipment up against early war kit is like the Spanish Empire going up against the Aztecs. Just one tiger up against early war armour would be a resounding win for the tiger practically every time and that's just not fair on the players. 

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Quote

We have no plans on turning this into what is essentially a pay to win/loot box style game.

But it's not, that's not the intention of it at all.

 

Quote

Putting late war equipment up against early war kit is like the Spanish Empire going up against the Aztecs. Just one tiger up against early war armour would be a resounding win for the tiger practically every time and that's just not fair on the players.

Obviously before someone can purchase anything - he has to play for it, together with other players on the low equipment.

There would never be a situation that hordes of late war armor go against the early armor - because the system would make it not possible due to  cost/use ratio.

And by the time that tigers are common, it would be 1941-1942, so everyone already would be on later tiers for free.  + some players from allied side, already would be on even later equipment from 1943-1944

Edited by nugx

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The idea I would support is shifting the rank-requirements down with TIERS.

Supply could even be fixed from day1 and not evolve over time. Just letting more and more players access the heavier equipment.  

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1 hour ago, Zebbeee said:

The idea I would support is shifting the rank-requirements down with TIERS.

Supply could even be fixed from day1 and not evolve over time. Just letting more and more players access the heavier equipment.  

So it's this idea, just different wording - it's the same as rank requirement shifting down.

 

Timeline moves up - the tiers go lower - more players get access to heavier equipment.

 

 

Edited by nugx

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14 minutes ago, nugx said:

So it's this idea, just different wording - it's the same as rank requirement shifting down.

 

Timeline moves up - the tiers go lower - more players get access to heavier equipment.

 

 

Yup and builders would own it all from day1 :D 

because of the numbers we need to audit ranks and add more ranks. 

The result would be similar to what @merlin51proposed

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Yup and builders would own it all from day1

Lol you guys assume that everyone would be driving around in a tiger on first day - but the system would be made so, to make it impossible, all you need to do is tweak the price/use ratio.

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Here, i've made a quick edit, to show you guys how it would progress

 

9Iw8vRD.png

 

chnGSfi.png

Edited by nugx

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10 hours ago, DOC said:

But DOC doesn't know anything he killed the game remember ? ;)

If there was just one thing I learned about you.. (not only) but if I had a take away and had to put one thing down. Balance was a P1 for you and when we had balance issues you fixed them.. one of the comments you said, I still repeat to this day.  "Nothing is for free".

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10 hours ago, jwilly said:

CRS is baby-stepping back into development by adding models that are clones of existing models, but with parameter changes to make them perform like a different version.

Why not do that same thing for ammo-tiering? The 88 model in T0 would have PzGr AP. The 88 model in T1 and beyond would have PzGr 39, which historically was first fielded in 1941. Ditto with other weapons that were significantly upgraded after introduction.

Early 17pdr would be the Pheasant... IIRC the only 17pdr to fire the current 17pdr APC in anger. Then there is the current 17pdr with the WRONG ammo. By the time the current 17pdr was fielded they no longer used the APC ammo but the APCBC ammo. As for the sites, It think the 1.9x sites where also the sites rushed in to service for the pheasant, though I think a very few numbers off the first production run of the current 17pdr where fitted with the 1.9x.  That being said, because the 17pdr is in its historical tier and representative of the 1943 ATG, it should be fitted with the 3x sites.

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My guess is that buying equipment from the future (i.e. sooner than historical research says it could have been fielded) is a non-starter.

There would be no historically supported context in which a Tiger could have been built and fielded in 1940. Tigers were built as soon as the design was sorted out, all of the subassemblies were manufacturable, and the fabrication and assembly capability existed.

No point in further discussion of that.

Quote

 

Dunkirk doesn't exist in the game unless you guys make it happen.  

 

If equipment availability was to depend on historical information that can be researched and analyzed even though it didn't happen historically due to an overriding event i.e. Dunkirk, that research has to be done and a timeline of soonest-availability assembled.

Only a relatively few weapons in our part of WWII could have been built and fielded sooner than they historically were. In the above concept, for most weapons, game availability will be the same as historical availability, because the gating factor was design-development or manufacturability. But, in some instances, historical circumstances delayed or halted development, manufacturing or fielding of a particular weapon. If that history plays out differently in-game, that weapon might be available, sooner or at all. Those instances are the ones that are of interest.

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Is pasting the same proposal that has been discussed in several threads (with general negativ replies to it) over and over again into new or ongoing threads considered to be a violation of forum rules?

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LOL.. looked up Nugx stats. No sorties on either side, no join date, no information period.

Whoooo could it be floating a pay to win game idea?

Come on man, out with who you are?

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