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nugx

Rank overhaul - point based system

64 posts in this topic

3 hours ago, Silky said:

I would favour a periodic reset of all ranks - annual? Every 10 campaigns? Every major version release? - but only if rank was disconnected from equipment access, which has been my point in this thread. 

 

When rank is disconnected from equipment, and there is 'personal spawn', this problem fixes itself, because eventualy you will lose the tiger or 190, and you have to play for it again -  the game then has it's own reset for every player - the personal spawn.

 

Look at the image - player has 8 personal uses of 110 C - if he loses the 8 planes - he has to purchase them again - it's like a reset.

Wm2GfP7.png

Edited by nugx

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Naturaly, the numbers of personal spawn would have to be scaled and tested, i'm only giving the general idea.

For example a player could buy  50 uses of 109 E4,  40 of 109 F2, 30 of G6 etc etc

The lower the tier, the more uses and cheaper, and the higher tier, more expensive and less uses.

Edited by nugx

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The 'point system' could be working also on top of the 'timeline' , so when it is 1945, and other players have depleted global armament, you could be able to purchase a few uses of anything you want if you would have the points.

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I agree with this but for Free to play players.. if you implement this system you are preventing subscribers that pay for the game to enjoy and experience the product they payed for.

To prevent the bad usage of good units by bad players I would prefer a positive discrimination as in having a reserve pool just for top ranked player and players who are in high K/D streaks with a particular X equipment.

Edited by pbveteran

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If I understood correctly, those of us who have been paying and supporting this game with our subscription and fundraisings now we have to [censored] and have nothing to please you who have not paid a dollar. And start again a campaign in equality with players who do not pay ... A player who does not pay could have better equipment than me paying? Are you kidding me, arent you?

The argument "when you reach the maximum rank you get bored or you have no motivations" here is not worth and is a clear symptom of not knowing what is going on ....

The other argument, that we veterans are very bad people and kill the poor recruits who can not play. Well look, just the same thing that happened to me and the whole world, and in this game you have to learn to play and kill and step by step progressing and improving, it's not the [censored] of the War Thunder ......It is a hard game and therefore very satisfying. It is satisfying to kill another veteran by listening to the steps or waiting to sap a tank when the gunner begins to shoot, those things you must learn while playing and especially dying.

If you want good equipment, pay a premium subscription, very simple.

PS: With Nugx you have 0 sorties this map and you want to change the game at these levels.... you want the game to your particular taste practically without having played it

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Quote

If you want good equipment, pay a premium subscription, very simple.

The definition of a failed game system.

People are not stupid, they will not play when others have advantage over them 'for paying'.

 

Either everyone has equal chances, or there will be low population - like it is currently.

Edited by nugx

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11 minutes ago, nugx said:

The definition of a failed game system.

People are not stupid, they will not play when others have advantage over them 'for paying'.

 

Either everyone has equal chances, or there will be low population - like it is currently.

Yes yes yes... you have the perfect solution.....All for free and we live in World of Candy.

You, as always, quoted a phrase.... and the rest?? Dont you have anything to say?? 

 

Aaaaaah and ty to call me and the rest of premium "stupids"..... you making serious progress. I do remember a post form you, the last week, requesting CRS to be a Hero Account, so are you a stupid too???

 

 

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4 hours ago, nugx said:

 

 

Do you have a solution?

Solutions for? Vets killing greentags? Yes consistency and patience and, of course, play more post less.

(I repeat you:  You, as always, quoted a phrase.... and the rest?? Dont you have anything to say??  )

Sorry I dont argue with people that call to the game supportes "stupids".

 

 

 

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A point system where premium accounts have infinite points and f2p can't access the best equipament of each tear would be the best model in my opinion. 

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56 minutes ago, sydspain said:

A point system where premium accounts have infinite points and f2p can't access the best equipament of each tear would be the best model in my opinion. 

 

This is premium accounts clubbing f2p players....... it's a good way to scare off new people.

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10 minutes ago, nugx said:

 

This is premium accounts clubbing f2p players....... it's a good way to scare off new people.

 

Exactly, that kind of people is better at playing maps and levels in the counterstrike than here. 

Not all games are for everyone.

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Look, year ago when the game went to steam, at first new players were checking it out.

gPVz5Wz.png  - 448 people

 

Just a month later

XV3C1po.png - 112 people

 

The new players were scared off by the current game systems.

Going to steam with the current systems was a shot in the foot.

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5 minutes ago, nugx said:

 

This is premium accounts clubbing f2p players....... it's a good way to scare off new people.

There has to be a good balance between free players and subscriptions...if you give too much to f2p then CRS doesn't get enough money to keep the servers going, and this top tier equipment (tigers, shermans, german lmg, bar, semiauto rifles, etc.) should work as an incentive to f2p to subscribe

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1 minute ago, sydspain said:

There has to be a good balance between free players and subscriptions...if you give too much to f2p then CRS doesn't get enough money to keep the servers going, and this top tier equipment (tigers, shermans, german lmg, bar, semiauto rifles, etc.) should work as an incentive to f2p to subscribe

Totally. Common sense statement.

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58 minutes ago, sydspain said:

There has to be a good balance between free players and subscriptions...if you give too much to f2p then CRS doesn't get enough money to keep the servers going, and this top tier equipment (tigers, shermans, german lmg, bar, semiauto rifles, etc.) should work as an incentive to f2p to subscribe

And people don't want to pay 15$ a month today for a 12 year old game.

 

Either the systems have to be re-worked to make the gameplay totaly new - then people can justify the 15$ so they are playing 'a new version'.

Or the game has to move to buy to play.

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3 minutes ago, nugx said:

And people don't want to pay 15$ a month today for a 12 year old game.

 

Either the systems have to be re-worked to make the gameplay totaly new - then people can justify the 15$ so they are playing 'a new version'.

Or the game has to move to buy to play.

I agree, right now this game doesn't worth 15$...

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11 minutes ago, nugx said:

And people don't want to pay 15$ a month today for a 12 year old game.

 

Either the systems have to be re-worked to make the gameplay totaly new - then people can justify the 15$ so they are playing 'a new version'.

Or the game has to move to buy to play.

The mainstream guys, not, clearly not.

Fortunately this is not Mainstream BS.

I agree that the price is expensive though.

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53 minutes ago, nugx said:

Either everyone has equal chances, or there will be low population - like it is currently.

it is so funny you bring this up all the time. Because everyone that is paying for this game HAS equal chances. Everybody that isn't paying for this game is not supposed to play it to the full scale. That's completely fine to me and I think to most paying cutomers here.

The system we have now is: You play for some time and you will unlock everything forever by doing so. It shouldn't take you a lot of time to do so btw. Why is that the case? Because there are only 2 tigers per brigade f.e. - you want the completely new guy to burn through these "cool" tanks in 5 seconds realising he doesn't know what he's doing with them? No. That's the only reason we have rank related unlocks in game.

What you are suggesting is that people have to GRIND for equal chances all the time. Which nobody wants to see in game. It's completely unrealistic as well. I want to fly the up to date fighter? So I have to grind to that by killing planes with a plane that has been taken out of frontline service 2 years ago - yeah. That's sound like a realistic representation.

Edited by vanapo

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@nugx

Thanks for the suggestion. I think most everyone shares criticisms with the current ranking system. It's just not very interesting at this time.

There are numerous issues I've identified with your proposal, though.

#1: In some of your posts, you mention purchasing a "future" tier level. This is antithetical to the game's core design (aka non-negotiable stuff). The concept of a timeline has been very important, and is also of absolute critical importance for balance.

#2: It's not monetizable without going Pay 2 Win. You seem to criticize the Subscription model as Pay2Win, but every single subscriber has the exact same opportunities as every other subscriber; the only difference is time spent in the game. There is no incentive with the system you propose to subscribe to the game, and in fact appear to call subscriptions "the definition of a failed game system".

The only recourse I see would be allowing players to purchase these spawn points, which in turn means purchasing higher tiers and "future" tiers, which means if I throw enough money at my screen I can seal club baby Hotchkisses in T0 with a Tiger, or I can take on the whole LW with just a P38.

I'm not sure how you might think this is superior for balance and enjoyment of the game.

#3: The system you propose encourages a permanent state. While lower tier infantry weapons can still wipe the floor with later tier ones (it's all about engagement range and being clever), the armor and air game basically require later-tier equipment unless you're doing a support mission. Since game actions will increase points, and kills are going to be a part of that, and it's easier to get a lot more points with later equipment: people who get access to higher tiers will tend to stay there and people stuck on lower tiers will have less opportunities to advance.

In the best-case scenario, players will have to play a lot of infantry to grind points to be competitive as armor or air,  and then hopefully use that to fund themselves remaining competitive. However, that is going to essentially kill what little flying community remains in the game, and will almost certainly [censored] off everyone who regularly plays armor.

 

There are some other little things, but the ones I put are the big concerns.

I would nominally support a path of temporary advancement for F2P players, but I don't see your suggestion as the correct way to handle that.

 

@kase250 Please calm down a little and use less inflammatory language. You can counter nugx's ideas and points without going into personal attacks and such. Let's please keep in mind that we want to encourage a positive community environment and tone down some of the toxicity, man.

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Because everyone that is paying for this game HAS equal chances

Little one thing, the paying player still has to rank up, meaning vets have an advantage over him, and then he has an advantage over other players.

 

 

Quote

What you are suggesting is that people have to GRIND for equal chances all the time.

lol we have been over this ad nauseum,  it would be the same playing as it is now.

 

Quote

I want to fly the up to date fighter? So I have to grind to that by killing planes with a plane that has been taken out of frontline service 2 years ago - yeah. That's sound like a realistic representation.

 

You want to fly up to date fighter?  You fly it for free together with the rest

 

rH0McIy.png

Edited by nugx

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13 minutes ago, nugx said:

Little one thing, the paying player still has to rank up, meaning vets have an advantage over him, and then he has an advantage over other players.

Temporarily, temporarily, temporarily, temporarily.

13 minutes ago, nugx said:

lol we have been over this ad nauseum,  it would be the same playing as it is now.

Again: playing a short time (temporarily) until you unlock everything forever (persitant equality) vs. grind the whole time (persistent inequality -> grind with the worse to play temporarily with the better). It seems like you don't get the difference between temporarily and persistend. As you keep talking about "playing a short time to unlock everything forever" like it is literally the same thing than "the permanent need to unlock everything you want to play"

13 minutes ago, nugx said:
Quote

I want to fly the up to date fighter? So I have to grind to that by killing planes with a plane that has been taken out of frontline service 2 years ago - yeah. That's sound like a realistic representation.

 

You want to fly up to date fighter?  You fly it for free together with the rest

And here we have another problem that is linked to your apparent misunderstanding of how a timeline works. The up to date plane is by definition the best plane available up to date. When I fly a 1939 plane against a 1942 plane, because 1942 planes are available - I don't care what the point system says about the year we are fighting in - because I hae to fly a plane that is outdated for 3 years against the up to date plane. What you are suggesting as a way to give everyting the same chance is exactly the opposite: It's making people grind for the better chances by spending time with outdated equipment against the better one. You really think this will motivate people to play?

Sorry @chaoswzkd but this guy is repeating this over and over again without taking the broad critizism into account at all. It's really starting to get on my nerves.

Edited by vanapo

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21 minutes ago, chaoswzkd said:

 

@kase250 Please calm down a little and use less inflammatory language. You can counter nugx's ideas and points without going into personal attacks and such. Let's please keep in mind that we want to encourage a positive community environment and tone down some of the toxicity, man.

@chaoswzkd Sorry but I have not entered into personal issues or provocative comments. It is more the OP that has dropped that the subscribers are something stupid. And I think it's disrespectful to pretend to have everything for free knowing there are people paying. I reiterate that I have not entered into anything personal so I do not have to apologize for anything. I try to be positive and in fact i am positive, the negative one is the OP, not me.  What's more, I think the OP should apologize he is again and again with the same statements: Kill the suscriptors player base. He only quotes the phrase that interests him and he does not care about the rest.....

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#1: In some of your posts, you mention purchasing a "future" tier level. This is antithetical to the game's core design (aka non-negotiable stuff). The concept of a timeline has been very important, and is also of absolute critical importance for balance.

Could you clarify more? I don't realy get what you are saying.

 

 

There is no incentive with the system you propose to subscribe to the game, and in fact appear to call subscriptions "the definition of a failed game system"

The incentive is that the system treats all players fairly - no hidden payments, no 'carrots on a stick' etc.

You pay for the game - everyone has the same chances - the game is fair.

Those who play 24/7 will ofcourse have a chance of a better tank or plane - but that is like this in every game, in WoW if you play 24/7 you will have a better gear than a player who plays few times a week.

 

The only recourse I see would be allowing players to purchase these spawn points, which in turn means purchasing higher tiers and "future" tiers, which means if I throw enough money at my screen I can seal club baby Hotchkisses in T0 with a Tiger, or I can take on the whole LW with just a P38.

no no, the 'spawn' is bought for points which you earn for playing.

 

: The system you propose encourages a permanent state. While lower tier infantry weapons can still wipe the floor with later tier ones (it's all about engagement range and being clever), the armor and air game basically require later-tier equipment unless you're doing a support mission. Since game actions will increase points, and kills are going to be a part of that, and it's easier to get a lot more points with later equipment: people who get access to higher tiers will tend to stay there and people stuck on lower tiers will have less opportunities to advance.

It's a double edged sword, because the higher tier, will have less uses of plane/tank.

And the 'timeline', take cares that no one will ever truly remain 'at the top clubbing everyone else'

 

In the best-case scenario, players will have to play a lot of infantry to grind points to be competitive as armor or air,  and then hopefully use that to fund themselves remaining competitive. However, that is going to essentially kill what little flying community remains in the game, and will almost certainly [censored] off everyone who regularly plays armor.

I think the points should remain for infantry when you play as inf, as a tanker for tanks, plane for planes etc.

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