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agenda21

WARP

28 posts in this topic

Agreed. Warping is a great game feature, but it is awfully complicated considering all the streamlining changes we've had to other stuff.

Edited by gretnine

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Warping isn't actually a feature, it's a side effect of the way the code was written regarding rtb-ing and reserving your unit so you can spawn back in with it.

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2 hours ago, agenda21 said:

Get rid of WARP from FMS or make a one button warp.

SO how close to a facility do you want the RTB range to be?  This is what 'warp' is a result of.  

Keep in mind RTB distance is universal, so it will also change non-warp RTB. 

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46 minutes ago, Nick said:

Warping isn't actually a feature, it's a side effect of the way the code was written regarding rtb-ing and reserving your unit so you can spawn back in with it.

Feature, mechanism, whatever it is, it's still unnecessarily complicated to use. If you want it to stay, make it easier.

Edited by gretnine

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3 hours ago, agenda21 said:

Get rid of WARP from FMS or make a one button warp.

WARP is not a feature..........its basically RTB'ing to the nearest owned facility

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5 minutes ago, gretnine said:

Feature, mechanism, whatever it is, it's still unnecessarily complicated to use. If you want it to stay, make it easier.

So demanding.. Its just an RTB at the local depot when you despawn.. Cant get much easier than that. There is no such thing as a warp in our codebase. 

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At some point in the last year, the despawn mechanic was edited so that you could no longer avoid the 10 second despawn timer to instantly despawn after spawning in at the FMS.  (technically you still can avoid the 10 second timer if you are fast enough but I probably manage to do it once in every 20 attempts).  


That extra 10 seconds hurts the effectiveness of warping a lot and should be reverted if possible.  Avoiding the despawn timer was only possible in the first few moments after spawning your unit in anyway, so I'm not sure what problem this change "fixed" exactly.

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1 hour ago, Nick said:

Warping isn't actually a feature, it's a side effect of the way the code was written regarding rtb-ing and reserving your unit so you can spawn back in with it.

So it is more or less a bug?

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22 minutes ago, SCKING said:

 

So demanding.. Its just an RTB at the local depot when you despawn.. Cant get much easier than that. There is no such thing as a warp in our codebase. 

So, we have this great addition to AOs that is unintentional and has been in the game for years, that can be used to make AOs last longer and get everyone even closer to the action. Perhaps even saving them the trouble of getting sniped while trying to get to the town (Especially the new player). Yet, we barely have players using it or even bothering to get warps because everyone knows that it's not going to be worth it. Only the vets know how to warp and sometimes we even see them not utilize it. Is it because they don't know or because they don't want to? Why have it if only a selective few who know about it might use it? 


But so be it. Let it stay the way it is. Just don't wonder when a two paragraph instruction wont get you anywhere -- if by some miracle you have a possibility to warp. We saw this happen plenty of times with the steam wave of new players. 

Edited by gretnine

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If I understand the issue correctly, can an FMS just speed up the resupply rate for depots if within the RTB range of said depot? Kinda like a steroid injection/life line kinda thing.

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36 minutes ago, choad said:

So it is more or less a bug?

While not a planned feature 'warp' is also not a bug (something not working as intended), it's simply an RTB to the closest facility (to wherever you happen to be at). 

The way to remove it would be to disallow emplacement of FMS within the re-spawn radius of friendly facilities (rendering close in defensive FMS's essentially dead), or alternatively reduce the RTB radius at facilities to less than the min emplacement distance.    

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18 minutes ago, madrebel said:

If I understand the issue correctly, can an FMS just speed up the resupply rate for depots if within the RTB range of said depot? Kinda like a steroid injection/life line kinda thing.

It could if enough people used it.   You'd need to spawn/despawn faster than the resupply tick for the depot.  

Also since the depot resupply is tied to whatever town resupply - anything over would ultimately end up back in the source spawn pool.   But it'd be a good way to keep a depot at 100%

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5 minutes ago, B2K said:

The way to remove it would be to disallow emplacement of FMS within the re-spawn radius of friendly facilities (rendering close in defensive FMS's essentially dead), or alternatively reduce the RTB radius at facilities to less than the min emplacement distance.    

Please no.  This game needs to facilitate more action rather than put additional barriers in front of action.  

 

As was said, warping is simply a consequence of the the RTB mechanics as they are.  Nothing more.  

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6 minutes ago, B2K said:

It could if enough people used it.   You'd need to spawn/despawn faster than the resupply tick for the depot.  

Also since the depot resupply is tied to whatever town resupply - anything over would ultimately end up back in the source spawn pool.   But it'd be a good way to keep a depot at 100%

Right this is too manual. Instead would it be possible if FMS is deployed close enough to essentially double the depot supply list as an example to simulate the success/proximity of the attacking forces?

that final surge, the lock down so to speak is perhaps not as smooth or as possible as it could be without tanks and or other vehicles hard locking the infantry spawns. The attackers always have that problem of time to battle when in reality, everyone in the company/division or w/e is going to essentially be right next to you. Granted D has this problem as well, having to come from spawns instead of always being in the field, but their time to battle is always less.

 

just seems combined arms are ALWAYS required to lock down instead of being desired when IRL infantry had many suppression abilities we don’t currently model and were perfectly capable of taking ground w/o tanks. 

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I think the main issue is the new players not knowing how to work the game interface. Perhaps, on despawn a tick box for rtb at the closest depot or fms.

Edited by dropbear

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The warp feature is not user friendly and explaining it to new players can be incredibly hard 

 

this is the crux of the issue - improve the way it works so new players can access it easily @SCKING

I’m not a fan of the magic teleport principle, I’d rather see it removed from the game 

Edited by Silky

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Warping is a bit gamey but it does make for some good inf fights. I'm not against making it easier, I've had to try to explain how to do it do many times over the years.

I'm actually working in the area of code responsible right now whilst I'm working on Overstock in 1.36

I'd have to think about how we could make it easier and whether it would be possible without effecting other features such as rtb or Overstock.

Another Dev is working on improving the Mobile spawn tick box (don't tell anyone, it's a secret) so it could possibly tie in with that, maybe on the screen where your unit is reserved there could be a button to spawn straight back in again via the depot not the FMS.

I'm just thinking out loud, I'm not saying that we are going to do it.

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1 minute ago, Nick said:

Warping is a bit gamey but it does make for some good inf fights. I'm not against making it easier, I've had to try to explain how to do it do many times over the years.

I'm actually working in the area of code responsible right now whilst I'm working on Overstock in 1.36

I'd have to think about how we could make it easier and whether it would be possible without effecting other features such as rtb or Overstock.

Another Dev is working on improving the Mobile spawn tick box (don't tell anyone, it's a secret) so it could possibly tie in with that, maybe on the screen where your unit is reserved there could be a button to spawn straight back in again via the depot not the FMS.

I'm just thinking out loud, I'm not saying that we are going to do it.

This is the type of post I'd expect from someone representing CRS. Thanks Nick for the info, even if just thinking out loud. 

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I'm personally against warping. We already have depot spawning. I rather have a good fight over a depot than have infantry running hidden in a bush line, de spawning 300m outside of town, and then magically appearing in the town square guns blazing.

In my view we should work to create more realistic infantry fights than a mechanic that allows infantry to warp through your outer perimeter defense.

The 360-degree mobile spawning makes it impossible to have any sort of realistic front, so most attacks devolve into a type of Stalingrad battle with infantry swarming in from all sides. Warping only makes this worse by promoting ever more unrealistic mobile spawn placements.

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16 hours ago, aismov said:

I'm personally against warping. We already have depot spawning. I rather have a good fight over a depot than have infantry running hidden in a bush line, de spawning 300m outside of town, and then magically appearing in the town square guns blazing.

In my view we should work to create more realistic infantry fights than a mechanic that allows infantry to warp through your outer perimeter defense.

The 360-degree mobile spawning makes it impossible to have any sort of realistic front, so most attacks devolve into a type of Stalingrad battle with infantry swarming in from all sides. Warping only makes this worse by promoting ever more unrealistic mobile spawn placements.

I agree. Of course there’s a balance to be struck but for me, the less magic spawning, insta-warping there is the better 

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please don't remove warping...

please don't even think about it

Edited by major0noob

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1 hour ago, major0noob said:

please don't remove warping...

please don't even think about it

Kind of hard as there is not really a warping function
It is simply the RTB function letting you RTB and respawn at the owned facility you despawned to

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So..remove warping would remove the ability to rtb?

If we want to remove warping would stopping the ability to rtb if your origin was not the town work? Of course that would break overstocking etc. unless you own both links AND the AB.

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