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      Hells Gate   03/24/2019

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      Date: 3/30/19 Time: 11:00 AM Server time/ 12:00pm EST/ 1600 GMT
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madrebel

Personas = Axis and Allied

10 posts in this topic

Would it be possible to change the sides/personas/combatants to be either axis or allied?

The thought here is to meld the existing chat channel system along with the mission system and avoid the split that the brits/french/us currently have and in theory the same thing the 'axis' will suffer from if when the italians are fully rolled out. Not to mention the Finns, Romanians, Hungarians, and other co-belligerents.

 

Really, ww2 is about axis vs allies.

To that end, can we just have Axis and Allied personas? If we can then can we leverage TOEs to determine which 'force' is actually at the flag and thinking forward to 1.36 and hybrid supply, which garrison TOE is assigned?

Problem as I see it is transferring rank from the existing German, British, and French personas over to new Axis or Allied personas.

 

The divide and comms issues from multiple 'forces' is a real issue IMO. We need everyoone on both sides on the same missions and chat channels IMO. Short of a full UI/chat system audit might this be a good compromise?

 

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I rather like the separate national forces of the Allies, and it is more in-line with history rather than not. Mission wise as long as you are on the same AO/DO marks are visible, so the issue is pretty minor overall. 

This being said, the forum has quite a few threads on UI and mission improvement ideas that would go a long way to fixing what you brought up (combined marks for all in area, spawning overhauls and squad groupings vs a lot of individual missions). I just think that if you made the game Allies vs Axis you are leaving out all the differences that each national force brings, which would be a big step back in my opinion.

Edited by raptor34

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Disagree with the minority of the issue. As long as we have GPS/AWACS maps the luftwaffe will always have an advantage as they’ll have better real time intel. Knowing where everything that is on mission is in real time is a significant advantage even on the ground.

As for history, do note as the war progressed the allied forces figured this out too giving up top down control to the US with Ike calling all the shots in Europe.

From a gameplay perspective I’ll argue having a cohesive ‘side’ is more important than historic division between the combatants early on. Also note, current CRS has already stated a desire to improve communication. This could go a long ways towards that goal.

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Just updated my reply. Well it’s a different issue but it would be good to get rid of the GPS/AWACS from a realism perspective. Flying with AWS off is a much different experience than with it on. If we could find a way to simulate radar based interception for factories areas the game could move away from AWS entirely, putting the emphasis back on comms and situational awareness.    

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I dont disagree, my premise is as few changes as possible presuming the gps map that shows friendlies is something we want to keep for w/e reasons.

get rid of friendlies on map or dont, that’s a different issue.

if you want everything on the same mission when multiple combatant TOEs are in play then you need to limit the origin ‘sides’ to one per - hence Axis and Allied.

You’re not really limiting the differences as you can differentiate the TOE lists to be exactly as they are now. Allied mostly/only players still have to learn a LOT more gear. In the future if/when Italy joins, again, axis mostly/only players will have all that gear to learn too.

Personas haven’t really ‘meant’ anything ever and really only presented a gameplay issue many many years ago for most of us, and, further, its a hurdle new players have to deal with. 

Here is a real world example. Did French and Polish pilots have to ‘level up’ in order to fly for the RAF? No, they were deemed worthy based on their existing experience, arranged into squadrons, assigned RAF planes, and in many cases immediately pressed into battle with very little training. 

Edited by madrebel

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This has been discussed and there are several coding challenges that are required to do this. The discussion will be most likely later this year.

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My personal take is that the persona's still remain separate since I think it is both historic and interesting (personally I wouldn't mind playing as the Finns for example in some hypothetical future even though they technically weren't in the Axis). Anyway. I think the solution is as you posted in the other thread - harmonized chat, map marking, and system function so that British/French/US (Canadian???) forces are different personas and groups but they can communicate together. I would also be for the ranks to go up for all personas on the side at the same time.

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I’m with madrebel on this one. There has never been any real point to the personas except in the minds of Allied players in the early years of the game. I think they are long past the odd Brit / French division that kept some of them from jumping between the two. Get rid of them and allow for unified target comms. A general overall simplified UI and mission system would benefit new players greatly. 

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If you think about a more natural UX flow, you really should't have to pick a Persona, there's really not a reason.  It should be entirely based on what brigade/flag is in the town.  This is true for Navy, Army and Air as well.   I've always found that aspect of the game a lot of extra clicks that are unnecessary.   Ultimately, the game should start,  you pick Axis or Allied  (should have 'estimated spawn time' shown on the screen) and that's it.    Then you're presented with the Active Battles map -- whatever AO you pick and what equipment you pick should then define your persona.    

I've never really played Allied, maybe once or twice a decade ago, but on the Axis side you don't pick between German or Italian, it's entirely driven by the equipment choice (Modello vs. K98) -- I realize there are not separate flags, but even if you did the equipment list should be integrated and your persona based on the equipment you choose.

It's great to see that CRS is thinking about this.

P-

 

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On 1/22/2019 at 8:15 PM, madrebel said:

Disagree with the minority of the issue. As long as we have GPS/AWACS maps the luftwaffe will always have an advantage as they’ll have better real time intel. Knowing where everything that is on mission is in real time is a significant advantage even on the ground.

As for history, do note as the war progressed the allied forces figured this out too giving up top down control to the US with Ike calling all the shots in Europe.

From a gameplay perspective I’ll argue having a cohesive ‘side’ is more important than historic division between the combatants early on. Also note, current CRS has already stated a desire to improve communication. This could go a long ways towards that goal.

Er.  Only thing that is differing is different missions on different nationalities, which happens on Axis when you have- different missions.

 

There is an effect on Allied players as they usually prefer one nation set over another and so tend to play that and either not choose or literally not do well with the other nation sets.  On the other hand Allies get more choice in problem solving and capability, so IMO it evens out.  Except for air, destroy RAF supply and most Allied air players log.

 

As I understood it the ranking issues were largely resolved as up to Rank 5 crosses over no matter what nation you ranked up in.  That WAS an issue, not really anymore but does give an incentive/goal to do that bit more to get the top end stuff.

 

Marking is more a function of what you marked as your goal/destination, lack of discipline in setting missions can cause mark problems.

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