kgarner

Current supply lists in beta..... 1.36

156 posts in this topic

Brits garrison supply
24 a13
15 vickers
8 DLC vick
7 mattys
5 uber vickers
4 DLC a13
2 CS mattys

146 rifles
41 thompson smg
23 lmgs
16 atr
11 engies
10 sappers
9 morts
9 snipers
8 DLC smg thompson
8 HC officers
5 grenadiers
4 reserve Smg thompson

French garrison supply
15 h39
12 s35
7 char
4 DLC h39
4 DLC r35
4 r35
3 pan's

135 rifles
38 SMG mas
23 LMG 
15 ATR
11 sniper
11 engies
8 morts
8 sapper
8 grenadier
8 reserve SMG
8 DLC NCO
8 DLC ammo bearer
8 HC
2 mas 40 semi's (? wtf)

German garrison supply 
15 p2
11 3f
6 38t
5 232
4 DLC 3f
4 DLC p2
3 stug B
3 4d

135 rifles
22 LMG
22 MP40
15 atr
11 modello rifles
11 morters
11 engies
8 modello smg
8 snipers
8 sapper 
8 HC
8 DLC NCO
8 DLC ammo bearer
4 reserve SMG modello
4 MP34 SMG
4 reserve MP34 smg
 

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Given the assumption, these are meant to be 1.36 testing numbers and hopefully wont be the live campaign numbers - I think it's a good idea we start the conversation now.   My experience in-game today (I admit only 6 or 7 hours isn't enough time to get a total handle on attrition functionality with these lists..... but I'm comfortable asserting a few points) There are too many tanks and not enough ways to kill them (from the axis perspective).  If there are going to be this many allied tanks T-0 then sapper numbers need a dramatic increase.  I would hate to see US primetime just turn into a camp fest.  9 Matties seems a bit excessive to me.  Back in the day there was 1 matty per AB supply..... 7 is just to much flat out.  Seems like some of the 41 brit thompsons should be reserve status ..... axis get 34 full ammo smg's with 8 reserve..... seems like the brits list should probably reflect that.... as of now there is a significant smg advantage. 34 vs 41.  I feel like inf numbers are just all around not high enough..... maybe i just need to get used to it but..... It doesn't feel right having inf run out before armor.  Haybes tonight allies where spawning every kind of tank including chars ..... well their inf supply was down to rifles.... that to me indicates a problem with how attrition is functioning .... you should run out of armor before you run out of inf in basically every situation.  And why do the french get a semi from the git??? 2 mas 40's wtf????

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If allies historically had less SMGs, then they should have a bit less in game - sure - maybe not 'real' numbers; but less.

Just like axis has less semis in later tier.

brits getting 41 and axis 34 just don't seem right... when historically they should have less.

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Agree here that the armored numbers are a pretty big tidal wave to try to break as an Axis defender. 9 Matty and 7 Char is a pretty big number to try to defend with 11 IIIF and 6 38t; IVD and IIIB are pretty ineffective against tanks. Then you factor in 24 A13s (!) for the British and 12 S35s for the French and its a tall order to defend a tow. Even pre-positioned 88s would have a tough time grinding down these numbers.

I think the armored numbers are just high across the board... 65 for the Brits, 49 for the French (?), and 51 for the Germans. Think closer to 30 tanks per side would be more reasonable given the infantry numbers we have. If necessary cut down on ATG numbers. And if towns fall faster because of low supply. Hey whats the big deal. At least the map will move!

 

EDIT: How about we just make the spawn lists uber simple. Does it really make sense to squabble over whether the Axis have 3 more SMG, or the French has 2 Mas40 in the spawn list? Im a fan of the KISS principle. If the French have the Mas40 then give them 148 rifles and 2 Mas40s, or 5... it really wont make a difference. And decrease the numbers of infantry players don't really use like the ammo guy, NCO, and mortar.

infspawn.jpg

Edited by aismov

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This is my idea of the tank numbers (decreased substantially), but if you noticed there isn't a crazy amount of sappers in the spawn list (and they could be decreased if necessary).

Some notes. For the Axis medium tank I would likely do 8 PzIIIF, 3 PzIV D, and 2 StugIIIB.

I don't think the British have a true "medium" tank until the Crusader in Tier 2, thus they get more A-13s which are more in line with the H-39 and Pz38t. The S-35 is the better medium tank, so the Axis have slightly more Medium and Light tanks versus the French. This is also balanced out by the Char.

Axis have more light tanks than the French to account for not having the excellent Panhard.

Axis have more scout cars, which accounts for excellent allied scout cars which can knock out German armor (but no vice versa).

Germans and French have no true tankettes, but I classify R-35 and PzII as such since nobody ever uses them; these numbers are kept to a minimum also for that reason

The total number of "main battle tanks" is essentially equal with the Axis have 2 more "tanks" but in reality these extra two tanks are StugIIIBs.

tanksspawn.jpg


This seems like a pretty fair spawn list for all sides. Allies get their heavies is numbers where players can actually play with them. Nobody can zerg a tank into town knowing there are another 50 you can spawn. The Axis have slightly more medium tanks, but this accounts for them not having true heavy tanks.

Thoughts?

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I don't think present supply is the campaign list, I think it is so you can have extra stuff during the non campaign part of the testing

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i think we should play with the actual supply..... if this isn't it..... we should use this time to test how the new lists function before we run a real campaign

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The supply in-game right now is the supply will start the next campaign with.  

We are watching and reading comments and we are open to supply adjustments after we have had the chance to watch live campaign play.  We will not be making supply changes every day but these are not set in stone.

Thanks for your input.

S!

 

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1 hour ago, TMAN said:

The supply in-game right now is the supply will start the next campaign with.  

We are watching and reading comments and we are open to supply adjustments after we have had the chance to watch live campaign play.  We will not be making supply changes every day but these are not set in stone.

Thanks for your input.

S!

 

lol

allied campfest inbound then ...

specially after every capped town by the allies ... the new town supply will be set to british by AHC :rolleyes:

7 + 2 CS Mattys are a bit too much for a "simple" garrison

there werent that many Mattys in real BoF that would justify this high number. 4 + 2 sounds better

Edited by undercova

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Well, to be FAIR (Foreign word) for each Matty we should match the Axis supplies with two 4D and still that is less than what it takes to kill a Matty… Would need about 7 or 8 but I know that wont happen.

Matty can sustain about 50-70 hits from 4D. All day. From ALL angles.

Now that would be deadly to the rest of Allies tanks so.... Give Allies 2 Mattys… 3 max. Like you do to the Tiger in later Tiers.

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Since I mostly fly I notice changes in air spawn lists over ground lists.

Quick question, supply in-game atm is old Tier 0. I'll take the German example. 110 C-4, 109 E-1, E-4 Ju-87 and 111. Few maps ago when supply was adjusted, French Air Force and LW received a few F-2s and H-81s to start out in Tier 0. Since I haven't seen them in this 1.36 test, does it mean that supply has gone back to old tier system for now? If this is just an error, can the Spit 2b be added to the list of limited additions since FAF and LW get a few of their Tier 1 fighters in Tier 0 now? Doesn't make sense why Spit 2b will be left out if supply hasn't gone back to the way it was. 

Just wondering. 

 

Edited by zippy

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10 hours ago, shagher said:

Well, to be FAIR (Foreign word) for each Matty we should match the Axis supplies with two 4D and still that is less than what it takes to kill a Matty… Would need about 7 or 8 but I know that wont happen.

Matty can sustain about 50-70 hits from 4D. All day. From ALL angles.

Now that would be deadly to the rest of Allies tanks so.... Give Allies 2 Mattys… 3 max. Like you do to the Tiger in later Tiers.

crap just got an engine kill frontally at 1000m - 10th shot of heat. and i dont know what im doing in an axis tank. Sure lifes tough as an axis tanker for about a week, but lets cut the hyperbole.

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I think kgamer is probably right.  The armor numbers in the garrison are a bit too much for the sapper levels.  Especially the 9 matilda supply in the garrisons while the axis are only going to get 8 sappers to handle those matildas.

I think CRS should try to get the supply balance right BEFORE launching a major new supply system.  Especially considering that HCs ability to correct supply problems with flag moves is going to be limited with the new system.

We want the launch of the new supply system  to be successful no?  I don’t think anyone wants to see a lot of complaining about supply balance  in the forums and in the game chats and on discord after the new system goes live.  What would the new and returning players think after seeing all those complaints?

We are beta testing this new supply system now.  We should try and  use this opportunity with the beta tester feedback to fix the supply issues before this system goes live.

People will be much more passionate about supply imbalances once we get into a live campaign with live campaign results.  Best to address the issues right now methinks.

Cheers!

Edited by krazydog
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12 hours ago, undercova said:

7 + 2 CS Mattys are a bit too much for a "simple" garrison

they're 500 pound$ units balanced by the 500 mark$ 2c's

^^^ literal balance now...

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Agree, looking at a couple of towns - nearly empty of infantry supply...... some 50 tanks still in stock.......

Too much armor in game.

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Yup agree... been looking at many spawn lists today and gutted of all infantry. Armor numbers need to go down by ~50%.

Players will need to learn to stop wasting supply too... but we'll adapt like we always do.

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Of course i'm not happy facing 3h's earlier than they were normally in either....

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11 hours ago, goreblimey said:

crap just got an engine kill frontally at 1000m - 10th shot of heat. and i dont know what im doing in an axis tank. Sure lifes tough as an axis tanker for about a week, but lets cut the hyperbole.

Vs what a Matilda ?  What were you in 4d or Stug? 

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On 4/8/2019 at 11:27 PM, delems said:

If allies historically had less SMGs, then they should have a bit less in game - sure - maybe not 'real' numbers; but less.

Just like axis has less semis in later tier.

brits getting 41 and axis 34 just don't seem right... when historically they should have less.

Haven't see much historically done when the US came into the war and got the industry going and had 10-15 to 1 tank advantage and a much larger air advantage. 

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2 hours ago, dre21 said:

Vs what a Matilda ?  What were you in 4d or Stug? 

4d firing at a Matilda , front on 1000m from a slight elevation . surprised me how it got an engine smoking but hey , didnt try to repeat it tho. i'll assume its repeatable. 

Edited by goreblimey

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