sydspain

Tz3 should have only 1 AO

204 posts in this topic

4 hours ago, themouse said:

actually on that front....so far....the  garrison not being routed when the ab is taken is negating some of the issues that you have when your very low pop  because the attacker has two hold all the cps too when capping the town...so it spreads  them out a bit  I am having better fights, the overpop side can't just cap the link cp and  pack the bunker to take he town

That is pretty good to hear!

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so CRS set the AO minimum down to 1 but they expect it to be a one-AO period only during TZ3

in order to keep the server from sitting  at 1 AO almost all day (like it was) they had to lower the population threshold in order to get more than 1 AO

the problem is that under the guise of balance and helping the underpop team they're continuing to reward a team for keeping its population as low as possible; we've had years of this

they also severely punish a team for keeping its population higher than the other side

can anyone explain how exactly are average player numbers on the server going to increase?

looking at the state of the allied team all the underpop help it doesn't really help them either, I mean they sit on defense the entire day and can't even pull off a normal attack anymore

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15 minutes ago, david06 said:

the problem is that under the guise of balance and helping the underpop team they're continuing to reward a team for keeping its population as low as possible; we've had years of this

they also severely punish a team for keeping its population higher than the other side

@david06 Here is an idea, if you don't like it spawn to the evil underpop side and help balance things out. Pretty simple concept, actually do what the game mechanics are effn' begging you to do. I understand it though if you prefer your side or just prefer being on the overpop side .... just quit your complaining when solutions like this become necessary.

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4 minutes ago, choad said:

@david06 Here is an idea, if you don't like it spawn to the evil underpop side and help balance things out. Pretty simple concept, actually do what the game mechanics are effn' begging you to do. I understand it though if you prefer your side or just prefer being on the overpop side .... just quit your complaining when solutions like this become necessary.

If he stops complaining he wouldn’t have anything else to post about

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35 minutes ago, choad said:

@david06 Here is an idea, if you don't like it spawn to the evil underpop side and help balance things out. Pretty simple concept, actually do what the game mechanics are effn' begging you to do. I understand it though if you prefer your side or just prefer being on the overpop side .... just quit your complaining when solutions like this become necessary.

choad can you tell me how many players difference "underpop" is nowadays?

because it looks like the difference from even to overpop is about 10 players

can't spawn on the underpop side when it fluctuates every 15 minutes

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2 hours ago, david06 said:

so CRS set the AO minimum down to 1 but they expect it to be a one-AO period only during TZ3

in order to keep the server from sitting  at 1 AO almost all day (like it was) they had to lower the population threshold in order to get more than 1 AO

the problem is that under the guise of balance and helping the underpop team they're continuing to reward a team for keeping its population as low as possible; we've had years of this

they also severely punish a team for keeping its population higher than the other side

can anyone explain how exactly are average player numbers on the server going to increase?

looking at the state of the allied team all the underpop help it doesn't really help them either, I mean they sit on defense the entire day and can't even pull off a normal attack anymore

CRS has done the following to assist:

  1. Provided more system driven supply to provide stable transitioning of the map
  2. Redeployed High Command's time to provide leadership to the community
  3. Returned back to a 1 AO minimum for TZ3 low pop period
  4. Adjusted AO's to be based off of the underpopulated sides population - not the total game population
  5. Enabled more AO's to be obtained faster than pre-1.36 standards
    1. Standard Attack Objectives
    2. Bridge Objectives 
  6. Provided shared tanks and equipment around Allied forces
  7. Restructured our entire Tables of Equipment driven by a balanced budget across all countries
  8. Reduced penalties against the overpopulated side
    1. Spawn delay reduced to a 10 second maximum
    2. Persona delay reduced to a 60 second maximum
  9. Provided a balanced capture mechanism
    1. Scales accordingly based on the imbalance percentage

This combination of maneuvers signal CRS listening, incorporating fair and reasonable changes in a timely manner and taking into context the lower and routine population periods to preserve the best experience for WWII Online possible.

The continuing sentiment of the Allies being doomed, needs to come to a full stop. CRS cannot code leadership or morale. We can listen and incorporate changes that work to promote both sides, but it's going to be up to each side's community to cultivate enjoyable experiences. There are good leaders on the Allied side and great players and Squad reforming. This is an appropriate action and while it's much easier to be the skeptic, I implore optimism for the sake of progress.

We stand ready to do our part and help - we need the same level of initiative and drive. We've provided tremendous solutions to support all of this, but if we are to have a semblance of a player driven game - players need to drive it and step up.

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I don't think anybody should ever expect CRS to code success for their side, best you can do is expect a fair opportunity.

 

Understand that means it may not go your way all the time, accept that a fair game also means you have to accept the possibility of being outplayed, approach this in the spirit of sportsmanship not Iwant Iwant Iwant, and do what you can during your time in game.

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Good call XOOM.

The faster we get balanced pop, faster the game will become enjoyable for everyone.

People doesn't care to log in game anymore when everything is played when they sleep or no pop.

Abnormal to face 21 hours of overpop vs 3 hours on the first 4 days of a campaign. (overall based on 4 days) : http://www.campaigncharts.com/

I was saying the same thing when allied did that to axis dozens of campaigns ago.

Edited by matamor
i am stats
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I have no objections about 1 AO in TZ3.

But I am still undecided about all the extra AOs in primetime.    I am not sure If I like them or not yet:

On the positive side the map moves a little bit more.  This is probably a good thing.

But there are also concerns with this extra AO system too in primetime:

Population gets stretched out too thin over too many towns.

Thete are less big battles and more skirmishes.  

There are more ninja caps with no defensive reaction.

If you want to seriously play strong defense, then you have to “ping pong “ constantly from town to town to wherever the next probe attack captures your spawnable.  (It can be annoying at times).

The extra AOs in primetime probably helps the overpop side a little more than the underpop side.

So based on all of the above, I still have mixed feelings about  all the extra AOs in primetime. I am not sure if I like them or not still.

Cheers!

 

Edited by krazydog

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Are there any plans to develop a XP/Ranking system that can reward and encourage players to play the underpop side? I'd suggest such a system would really help this game, across various different areas ripe for improvement

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3 hours ago, krazydog said:

There are more ninja caps with no defensive reaction.

i just logged from TZ3, pop was mostly even. allies just didn't show up to defend. i marathon gamed, and its been the case all day, allies don't respond to ews or DO's popping up.

in TZ3 allies were all at the 4 hour AO, axis secured it then moved to their AO, which allies didn't show up to.

 

 

also, axis in TZ3 just have more fun playing. regardless of winning or loosing, they're a fun group to play video games with.

allies drove me to bordome to the point where i flew a blen to cut a spawn with its tail gunner.

Edited by major0noob

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Eliminate the AO/DO system. It's a red herring that obscures the fact that side imbalance comes from poor leadership and poor morale. Improve leadership and morale then time zones will become a non-issue.

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1 hour ago, major0noob said:

allies drove me to bordome to the point where i flew a blen to cut a spawn with its tail gunner.

That was you? :lol:

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19 hours ago, david06 said:

choad can you tell me how many players difference "underpop" is nowadays?

because it looks like the difference from even to overpop is about 10 players

can't spawn on the underpop side when it fluctuates every 15 minutes

I suspect it is percentage based, not a hard number. But i do not know for fact.

I am not sure what time of day you play but between 11pm and 6am CST (5am and 12pm GMT) there is very little fluctuation. The last part of TZ3 (between 6am and 9am CST) yeah you will see that it fluctuates more.

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5 hours ago, major0noob said:

i just logged from TZ3, pop was mostly even. allies just didn't show up to defend. i marathon gamed, and its been the case all day, allies don't respond to ews or DO's popping up.

in TZ3 allies were all at the 4 hour AO, axis secured it then moved to their AO, which allies didn't show up to.

 

 

also, axis in TZ3 just have more fun playing. regardless of winning or loosing, they're a fun group to play video games with.

allies drove me to boredom to the point where i flew a blen to cut a spawn with its tail gunner.

The Allies are getting precariously close to the point of no return.  

 

There used to be a lot more back and forth chat between the PB and HC.  Questions like "what's needed?" "where to next?" "what FBs do we need?" "how is supply?" "do we need a new AO?", and their respective answers.

 

Since the chat channel change where Side is no longer a default channel, Allied comms feel dead.  They were kinda dead already, but now they are more dead than I've ever seen.  I have a feeling this impacted the Axis side's comms too, but maybe not as much seeing as they've had channel 10 since time immemorial.  Or maybe the Allies are still tuned to Side, and they just don't talk.  

 

The Allies already had a problem with too many small squads who don't work together.  It feels like the loss of Side chat has only amplified this issue with coordination.  Getting your whole side to tune to the same channel can be a mountain to climb in its own right. 

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41 minutes ago, Capco said:

The Allies are getting precariously close to the point of no return.  

 

There used to be a lot more back and forth chat between the PB and HC.  Questions like "what's needed?" "where to next?" "what FBs do we need?" "how is supply?" "do we need a new AO?", and their respective answers.

 

Since the chat channel change where Side is no longer a default channel, Allied comms feel dead.  They were kinda dead already, but now they are more dead than I've ever seen.  I have a feeling this impacted the Axis side's comms too, but maybe not as much seeing as they've had channel 10 since time immemorial.  Or maybe the Allies are still tuned to Side, and they just don't talk.  

 

The Allies already had a problem with too many small squads who don't work together.  It feels like the loss of Side chat has only amplified this issue with coordination.  Getting your whole side to tune to the same channel can be a mountain to climb in its own right. 

Forming AEF from 7 squads that had some population left was a challenge but i been calling out on side chat for players/vets on comms to get with us but we barely get any new additions and we are usually top killing/map moving squad for both sides...athough matastatho joined us this week but we are not seeing the returning players that i had hoped for...i sent xoom an email for inactive AEF call to arms type thing but he so swamped he hasnt sent anything out yet as i dont have access to these guys emails and out old AEF website has been down for a few years we only have a Facebook group with about 65 of us and out of them about 20-25 are very active ingame....no more squads to work with is no bueno....not to go to off topic since this has nothing to do with tz3 just responding on comms/lack of squads and how we can get better...AEF formed after axis had won 7 maps in a row 

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its not just chat, they do stuff effortlessly. its not that they're not 'soo good the game is easy'

but they get the in-game chores done without a fuss

 

as allied: i constantly see only 1 spawn per ao situations, no defenders showing up situations, clinging to garbage battles, and abandoning a DO ( @XOOM )

from 2100 GMT to 0300 GMT, as axis, this wasn't the game.

 

if a AO was garbage, they'd leave. no fuss from HC and the PB, it wasn't fun it's ok to leave.

when a DO dropped, it was a fresh fight and people were willing to play it

and when the DO escalated, people stayed, it wasn't as chaotic as allies because the early crew did damage control (not loosing 3 CP's by softcap)

 

best of all, AO's had spawns. GOOD spawns, min dist to 500m. with this distance, it did not feel like 3:1, we were able to spend less time walking and more time in our teammates ZoC's pushing our ZoC killzones in.

allies make 600m-1.5km spawns, their killzone outside of town was weak, too much time spent walking, more people walking than holding and pushing the ZoC into town.

 

 

 

heck, just look at http://www.campaigncharts.com/

today's pop balance grouped by 15min.

the most extreme case (0000-0800  -TZ3  ) is only a 14% difference, but throughout the night allies just didn't fight like even pop.

with the super distant eFMS's and lack of defenders showing up, it did feel like we had 1.5x - 3x the people on axis though.

Edited by major0noob

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looking at the chart from the past few days, it looks like the 0800-1600 GMT time zone is the most wildly imbalanced

Edited by major0noob

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14 minutes ago, major0noob said:

best of all, AO's had spawns. GOOD spawns, min dist to 500m. with this distance, it did not feel like 3:1, we were able to spend less time walking and more time in our teammates ZoC's pushing our ZoC killzones in.

allies make 600m-1.5km spawns, their killzone outside of town was weak, too much time spent walking, more people walking than holding and pushing the ZoC into town.

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me personally, I despise playing defense.  I guess if I wanted to, I could watch for EWS all day and instantly take down every truck that comes my way, but that'd be boring as [censored].  

 

Likewise, the reason you see Allied FMSs so far out is because some players on the Axis love to watch for EWS and stop the action before it even gets started.  It's like they get turned on by it.  

 

When the FMS came out, the name of the game became "let's frustrate the crap out of each other until one side blinks" and the Allies blinked first.  What I mean is, we let our lack of success on AOs filter down into our DOs.  And so you have better Axis FMSs simply because they aren't challenged as often.  

Edited by Capco

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4 hours ago, Capco said:

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me personally, I despise playing defense.  I guess if I wanted to, I could watch for EWS all day and instantly take down every truck that comes my way, but that'd be boring as [censored].  

 

Likewise, the reason you see Allied FMSs so far out is because some players on the Axis love to watch for EWS and stop the action before it even gets started.  It's like they get turned on by it.  

 

When the FMS came out, the name of the game became "let's frustrate the crap out of each other until one side blinks" and the Allies blinked first.  What I mean is, we let our lack of success on AOs filter down into our DOs.  And so you have better Axis FMSs simply because they aren't challenged as often.  

i used to do it for allies. after killing fun i felt too dirty to keep it up

me and a few other regulars were the first response guys. its soo easy, i went to excruciating detail last year. yet guys i've never seen in the first response team tell me otherwise.

 

 

in all fairness though, it's strongly encouraged by everyone. even no-HC levels of inactivity would raise concerns.

winning over having fun i guess.

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Came on last night my time. Everyone knows it as TZ3.

HC silent apart from the odd .allied need boots now nonsense.  Or if you want to win get on discord garbage. 

Hc left without a word just POOF ! gone 

Allies then Held Antwerp Central > won Antwerp North > won Etain > won stenay . With no  HC basically until the end Of  etain Ao. 

Same HC came back plus a cpl more, 4 Hc total

0 comms  0 coordination on the side chat or any chat. 

Went up to 2 Aos  Both Set With No setup No communication other than .Allied Get here now/ Need boots NOW/ Need missions NOw blah blah blah after the Ao has set.

IS that how its done NOW?  do we not setup Aos before placing?

FAll back is get on discord //  we will never win if we don't all get on discord excuse.

What BS basic coordination and motivation is HC primary role especially now you don't have to Worry about flag moves and Timers. 

However, that is done Doesn't matter BUt if you have 4 HC on discord and very FEW players You need to get the MEssage Out and organise. Its not good enough to be silent and Do nothing other than Blame the players. 

Is it really practical to have 20 or more ppl, on 1 discord channel?  can you imagine the chatter, how the F can you play effectively with that background noise?   

HC has never been easier from what I can see. 

I like the changes, it makes the fight winnable for both defence and attack.  But nothing has changed the better team/side will win most fights if the POp is Not totally out of whack.  

Discord Is useful and has its place BUT Don't expect to Win anything if your message isn't getting where it needs to go. 

 

 

Edited by sw1
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40 minutes ago, sw1 said:

Came on last night my time. Everyone knows it as TZ3.--------------Accurate

HC silent apart from the odd .allied need boots now nonsense.  Or if you want to win get on discord garbage. --------------Not accurate

Hc left without a word just POOF ! gone -------------Not accurate.  When I log off, as I did last night, I ALWAYS pass the baton to whoever else is on from AHC, and if not, as was the case last night, I ALWAYS let everyone know that I am logging off for the evening.

Allies then Held Antwerp Central > won Antwerp North > won Etain > won stenay . With no  HC basically until the end Of  etain Ao. --------Good job.  I am sorry we are still a little short-handed on the latenight AHC crew.

Same HC came back plus a cpl more, 4 Hc total------Perhaps part of the issue here is that you didn't realize HC (me) was ingame for a good portion of the timeframe you are talking about.

0 comms  0 coordination on the side chat or any chat. --------Not accurate, unless again you are failing to realize that I am AHC.

Went up to 2 Aos  Both Set With No setup No communication other than .Allied Get here now/ Need boots NOW/ Need missions NOw blah blah blah after the Ao has set.

IS that how its done NOW?  do we not setup Aos before placing?--------I won't discuss operational plans in general discussion.  We have an area for those types of discussions.

FAll back is get on discord //  we will never win if we don't all get on discord excuse.-------My opinion only, but I share your frustration with some folks' overemphasis on the use of voice coms.  We have to get the message out to everyone regardless of whether or not they are on discord.

What BS basic coordination and motivation is HC primary role especially now you don't have to Worry about flag moves and Timers.------Accurate, and a work in progress. 

However, that is done Doesn't matter BUt if you have 4 HC on discord and very FEW players You need to get the MEssage Out and organise. Its not good enough to be silent and Do nothing other than Blame the players. 

Is it really practical to have 20 or more ppl, on 1 discord channel?  can you imagine the chatter, how the F can you play effectively with that background noise?   

HC has never been easier from what I can see.---------It is certainly easier in some ways then when I was AHC in the 'old days', but in others, (lack of squad presence, etc), it is actually more difficult. 

I like the changes, it makes the fight winnable for both defence and attack.  But nothing has changed the better team/side will win most fights if the POp is Not totally out of whack.  

Discord Is useful and has its place BUT Don't expect to Win anything if your message isn't getting where it needs to go. 

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, Capco said:

Likewise, the reason you see Allied FMSs so far out is because some players on the Axis love to watch for EWS and stop the action before it even gets started.  It's like they get turned on by it.  

Watch for EWS and kill enemy trucks...Isn't that the way this game is supposed to play?

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@sw1

S! and welcome back

You maybe did not realize it, and we were very busy, remember I was with you at twerp, trying to staunch the bleeding.
Augetout was there with us, not at the map screen micromanaging, but on the ground with us, he was instrumental in retaining the central AB
So a lot of his comms were in the origin and objective channels.

He did alert when he had to log, but again, it was a bit busy for us, so you could have naturally missed it.

Also, at times things got busy for him too, like when the AB would get hit, being the man on the ground rather than at map
he could have missed some chat while trying to repel a capture attempt.
He wouldn't have meant to, but I miss all kinds of stuff too when people are trying to attack me, you got shot that one time because I couldn't type you
a warning cause some guy was trying to put holes in me.
I know he did die several times, while under attack, from typing comms.
It is hard when you are alone

We do need more people in AHC in the later time zones, especially those like you who lead more from the ground rather
than just from the map, so I hope you are still considering it

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25 minutes ago, sydspain said:

Watch for EWS and kill enemy trucks...Isn't that the way this game is supposed to play?

Kind of, that's only part of it.

watch EWS, kill trucks
Said trucks then respond by bringing in support to slap your truck hunters off the map, and declaring WE WILL PUT FMS HERE
You of course respond by sending out units to declare NO MY YARD YOU NO HAS EFMS!
and you kind of go from there.
Sometimes you have to start with FMS back further to get infantry into the area and establish closer zones of control
or try to draw you out farther and chew your forces down
Then you try something to counter that etc etc.

Moves and counter moves, lots of variations

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