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sydspain

Tz3 should have only 1 AO

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matamor

Good call XOOM.

The faster we get balanced pop, faster the game will become enjoyable for everyone.

People doesn't care to log in game anymore when everything is played when they sleep or no pop.

Abnormal to face 21 hours of overpop vs 3 hours on the first 4 days of a campaign. (overall based on 4 days) : http://www.campaigncharts.com/

I was saying the same thing when allied did that to axis dozens of campaigns ago.

Edited by matamor
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krazydog

I have no objections about 1 AO in TZ3.

But I am still undecided about all the extra AOs in primetime.    I am not sure If I like them or not yet:

On the positive side the map moves a little bit more.  This is probably a good thing.

But there are also concerns with this extra AO system too in primetime:

Population gets stretched out too thin over too many towns.

Thete are less big battles and more skirmishes.  

There are more ninja caps with no defensive reaction.

If you want to seriously play strong defense, then you have to “ping pong “ constantly from town to town to wherever the next probe attack captures your spawnable.  (It can be annoying at times).

The extra AOs in primetime probably helps the overpop side a little more than the underpop side.

So based on all of the above, I still have mixed feelings about  all the extra AOs in primetime. I am not sure if I like them or not still.

Cheers!

 

Edited by krazydog

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Silky

Are there any plans to develop a XP/Ranking system that can reward and encourage players to play the underpop side? I'd suggest such a system would really help this game, across various different areas ripe for improvement

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major0noob
3 hours ago, krazydog said:

There are more ninja caps with no defensive reaction.

i just logged from TZ3, pop was mostly even. allies just didn't show up to defend. i marathon gamed, and its been the case all day, allies don't respond to ews or DO's popping up.

in TZ3 allies were all at the 4 hour AO, axis secured it then moved to their AO, which allies didn't show up to.

 

 

also, axis in TZ3 just have more fun playing. regardless of winning or loosing, they're a fun group to play video games with.

allies drove me to bordome to the point where i flew a blen to cut a spawn with its tail gunner.

Edited by major0noob

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gavalink

Eliminate the AO/DO system. It's a red herring that obscures the fact that side imbalance comes from poor leadership and poor morale. Improve leadership and morale then time zones will become a non-issue.

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sydspain
1 hour ago, major0noob said:

allies drove me to bordome to the point where i flew a blen to cut a spawn with its tail gunner.

That was you? :lol:

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Capco
5 hours ago, major0noob said:

i just logged from TZ3, pop was mostly even. allies just didn't show up to defend. i marathon gamed, and its been the case all day, allies don't respond to ews or DO's popping up.

in TZ3 allies were all at the 4 hour AO, axis secured it then moved to their AO, which allies didn't show up to.

 

 

also, axis in TZ3 just have more fun playing. regardless of winning or loosing, they're a fun group to play video games with.

allies drove me to boredom to the point where i flew a blen to cut a spawn with its tail gunner.

The Allies are getting precariously close to the point of no return.  

 

There used to be a lot more back and forth chat between the PB and HC.  Questions like "what's needed?" "where to next?" "what FBs do we need?" "how is supply?" "do we need a new AO?", and their respective answers.

 

Since the chat channel change where Side is no longer a default channel, Allied comms feel dead.  They were kinda dead already, but now they are more dead than I've ever seen.  I have a feeling this impacted the Axis side's comms too, but maybe not as much seeing as they've had channel 10 since time immemorial.  Or maybe the Allies are still tuned to Side, and they just don't talk.  

 

The Allies already had a problem with too many small squads who don't work together.  It feels like the loss of Side chat has only amplified this issue with coordination.  Getting your whole side to tune to the same channel can be a mountain to climb in its own right. 

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Jsilec
41 minutes ago, Capco said:

The Allies are getting precariously close to the point of no return.  

 

There used to be a lot more back and forth chat between the PB and HC.  Questions like "what's needed?" "where to next?" "what FBs do we need?" "how is supply?" "do we need a new AO?", and their respective answers.

 

Since the chat channel change where Side is no longer a default channel, Allied comms feel dead.  They were kinda dead already, but now they are more dead than I've ever seen.  I have a feeling this impacted the Axis side's comms too, but maybe not as much seeing as they've had channel 10 since time immemorial.  Or maybe the Allies are still tuned to Side, and they just don't talk.  

 

The Allies already had a problem with too many small squads who don't work together.  It feels like the loss of Side chat has only amplified this issue with coordination.  Getting your whole side to tune to the same channel can be a mountain to climb in its own right. 

Forming AEF from 7 squads that had some population left was a challenge but i been calling out on side chat for players/vets on comms to get with us but we barely get any new additions and we are usually top killing/map moving squad for both sides...athough matastatho joined us this week but we are not seeing the returning players that i had hoped for...i sent xoom an email for inactive AEF call to arms type thing but he so swamped he hasnt sent anything out yet as i dont have access to these guys emails and out old AEF website has been down for a few years we only have a Facebook group with about 65 of us and out of them about 20-25 are very active ingame....no more squads to work with is no bueno....not to go to off topic since this has nothing to do with tz3 just responding on comms/lack of squads and how we can get better...AEF formed after axis had won 7 maps in a row 

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major0noob

its not just chat, they do stuff effortlessly. its not that they're not 'soo good the game is easy'

but they get the in-game chores done without a fuss

 

as allied: i constantly see only 1 spawn per ao situations, no defenders showing up situations, clinging to garbage battles, and abandoning a DO ( @XOOM )

from 2100 GMT to 0300 GMT, as axis, this wasn't the game.

 

if a AO was garbage, they'd leave. no fuss from HC and the PB, it wasn't fun it's ok to leave.

when a DO dropped, it was a fresh fight and people were willing to play it

and when the DO escalated, people stayed, it wasn't as chaotic as allies because the early crew did damage control (not loosing 3 CP's by softcap)

 

best of all, AO's had spawns. GOOD spawns, min dist to 500m. with this distance, it did not feel like 3:1, we were able to spend less time walking and more time in our teammates ZoC's pushing our ZoC killzones in.

allies make 600m-1.5km spawns, their killzone outside of town was weak, too much time spent walking, more people walking than holding and pushing the ZoC into town.

 

 

 

heck, just look at http://www.campaigncharts.com/

today's pop balance grouped by 15min.

the most extreme case (0000-0800  -TZ3  ) is only a 14% difference, but throughout the night allies just didn't fight like even pop.

with the super distant eFMS's and lack of defenders showing up, it did feel like we had 1.5x - 3x the people on axis though.

Edited by major0noob

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major0noob

looking at the chart from the past few days, it looks like the 0800-1600 GMT time zone is the most wildly imbalanced

Edited by major0noob

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Capco
14 minutes ago, major0noob said:

best of all, AO's had spawns. GOOD spawns, min dist to 500m. with this distance, it did not feel like 3:1, we were able to spend less time walking and more time in our teammates ZoC's pushing our ZoC killzones in.

allies make 600m-1.5km spawns, their killzone outside of town was weak, too much time spent walking, more people walking than holding and pushing the ZoC into town.

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me personally, I despise playing defense.  I guess if I wanted to, I could watch for EWS all day and instantly take down every truck that comes my way, but that'd be boring as [censored].  

 

Likewise, the reason you see Allied FMSs so far out is because some players on the Axis love to watch for EWS and stop the action before it even gets started.  It's like they get turned on by it.  

 

When the FMS came out, the name of the game became "let's frustrate the crap out of each other until one side blinks" and the Allies blinked first.  What I mean is, we let our lack of success on AOs filter down into our DOs.  And so you have better Axis FMSs simply because they aren't challenged as often.  

Edited by Capco

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major0noob
4 hours ago, Capco said:

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me personally, I despise playing defense.  I guess if I wanted to, I could watch for EWS all day and instantly take down every truck that comes my way, but that'd be boring as [censored].  

 

Likewise, the reason you see Allied FMSs so far out is because some players on the Axis love to watch for EWS and stop the action before it even gets started.  It's like they get turned on by it.  

 

When the FMS came out, the name of the game became "let's frustrate the crap out of each other until one side blinks" and the Allies blinked first.  What I mean is, we let our lack of success on AOs filter down into our DOs.  And so you have better Axis FMSs simply because they aren't challenged as often.  

i used to do it for allies. after killing fun i felt too dirty to keep it up

me and a few other regulars were the first response guys. its soo easy, i went to excruciating detail last year. yet guys i've never seen in the first response team tell me otherwise.

 

 

in all fairness though, it's strongly encouraged by everyone. even no-HC levels of inactivity would raise concerns.

winning over having fun i guess.

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sw1

Came on last night my time. Everyone knows it as TZ3.

HC silent apart from the odd .allied need boots now nonsense.  Or if you want to win get on discord garbage. 

Hc left without a word just POOF ! gone 

Allies then Held Antwerp Central > won Antwerp North > won Etain > won stenay . With no  HC basically until the end Of  etain Ao. 

Same HC came back plus a cpl more, 4 Hc total

0 comms  0 coordination on the side chat or any chat. 

Went up to 2 Aos  Both Set With No setup No communication other than .Allied Get here now/ Need boots NOW/ Need missions NOw blah blah blah after the Ao has set.

IS that how its done NOW?  do we not setup Aos before placing?

FAll back is get on discord //  we will never win if we don't all get on discord excuse.

What BS basic coordination and motivation is HC primary role especially now you don't have to Worry about flag moves and Timers. 

However, that is done Doesn't matter BUt if you have 4 HC on discord and very FEW players You need to get the MEssage Out and organise. Its not good enough to be silent and Do nothing other than Blame the players. 

Is it really practical to have 20 or more ppl, on 1 discord channel?  can you imagine the chatter, how the F can you play effectively with that background noise?   

HC has never been easier from what I can see. 

I like the changes, it makes the fight winnable for both defence and attack.  But nothing has changed the better team/side will win most fights if the POp is Not totally out of whack.  

Discord Is useful and has its place BUT Don't expect to Win anything if your message isn't getting where it needs to go. 

 

 

Edited by sw1
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Augetout
40 minutes ago, sw1 said:

Came on last night my time. Everyone knows it as TZ3.--------------Accurate

HC silent apart from the odd .allied need boots now nonsense.  Or if you want to win get on discord garbage. --------------Not accurate

Hc left without a word just POOF ! gone -------------Not accurate.  When I log off, as I did last night, I ALWAYS pass the baton to whoever else is on from AHC, and if not, as was the case last night, I ALWAYS let everyone know that I am logging off for the evening.

Allies then Held Antwerp Central > won Antwerp North > won Etain > won stenay . With no  HC basically until the end Of  etain Ao. --------Good job.  I am sorry we are still a little short-handed on the latenight AHC crew.

Same HC came back plus a cpl more, 4 Hc total------Perhaps part of the issue here is that you didn't realize HC (me) was ingame for a good portion of the timeframe you are talking about.

0 comms  0 coordination on the side chat or any chat. --------Not accurate, unless again you are failing to realize that I am AHC.

Went up to 2 Aos  Both Set With No setup No communication other than .Allied Get here now/ Need boots NOW/ Need missions NOw blah blah blah after the Ao has set.

IS that how its done NOW?  do we not setup Aos before placing?--------I won't discuss operational plans in general discussion.  We have an area for those types of discussions.

FAll back is get on discord //  we will never win if we don't all get on discord excuse.-------My opinion only, but I share your frustration with some folks' overemphasis on the use of voice coms.  We have to get the message out to everyone regardless of whether or not they are on discord.

What BS basic coordination and motivation is HC primary role especially now you don't have to Worry about flag moves and Timers.------Accurate, and a work in progress. 

However, that is done Doesn't matter BUt if you have 4 HC on discord and very FEW players You need to get the MEssage Out and organise. Its not good enough to be silent and Do nothing other than Blame the players. 

Is it really practical to have 20 or more ppl, on 1 discord channel?  can you imagine the chatter, how the F can you play effectively with that background noise?   

HC has never been easier from what I can see.---------It is certainly easier in some ways then when I was AHC in the 'old days', but in others, (lack of squad presence, etc), it is actually more difficult. 

I like the changes, it makes the fight winnable for both defence and attack.  But nothing has changed the better team/side will win most fights if the POp is Not totally out of whack.  

Discord Is useful and has its place BUT Don't expect to Win anything if your message isn't getting where it needs to go. 

 

 

 

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sydspain
13 hours ago, Capco said:

Likewise, the reason you see Allied FMSs so far out is because some players on the Axis love to watch for EWS and stop the action before it even gets started.  It's like they get turned on by it.  

Watch for EWS and kill enemy trucks...Isn't that the way this game is supposed to play?

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Merlin51

@sw1

S! and welcome back

You maybe did not realize it, and we were very busy, remember I was with you at twerp, trying to staunch the bleeding.
Augetout was there with us, not at the map screen micromanaging, but on the ground with us, he was instrumental in retaining the central AB
So a lot of his comms were in the origin and objective channels.

He did alert when he had to log, but again, it was a bit busy for us, so you could have naturally missed it.

Also, at times things got busy for him too, like when the AB would get hit, being the man on the ground rather than at map
he could have missed some chat while trying to repel a capture attempt.
He wouldn't have meant to, but I miss all kinds of stuff too when people are trying to attack me, you got shot that one time because I couldn't type you
a warning cause some guy was trying to put holes in me.
I know he did die several times, while under attack, from typing comms.
It is hard when you are alone

We do need more people in AHC in the later time zones, especially those like you who lead more from the ground rather
than just from the map, so I hope you are still considering it

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Merlin51
25 minutes ago, sydspain said:

Watch for EWS and kill enemy trucks...Isn't that the way this game is supposed to play?

Kind of, that's only part of it.

watch EWS, kill trucks
Said trucks then respond by bringing in support to slap your truck hunters off the map, and declaring WE WILL PUT FMS HERE
You of course respond by sending out units to declare NO MY YARD YOU NO HAS EFMS!
and you kind of go from there.
Sometimes you have to start with FMS back further to get infantry into the area and establish closer zones of control
or try to draw you out farther and chew your forces down
Then you try something to counter that etc etc.

Moves and counter moves, lots of variations

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major0noob

you underestimate the trucks vunrability

not just how easy it is to kill them, but the difficulty in defending them as well

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Capco
3 hours ago, major0noob said:

you underestimate the trucks vunrability

not just how easy it is to kill them, but the difficulty in defending them as well

Exactly.  You can have a 5 tank column with a dozen infantry on foot and aerial recon in support of that one truck, and it still only takes one shot from a rifleman hidden in a bush for that truck to be taken out.  

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Capco

Also, wtf happened last night?  That's the most towns I've seen the Allies take overnight in 2+ years.  

Edited by Capco

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Kilemall
On 5/5/2019 at 4:58 AM, gavalink said:

Eliminate the AO/DO system. It's a red herring that obscures the fact that side imbalance comes from poor leadership and poor morale. Improve leadership and morale then time zones will become a non-issue.

Ridiculous.  Already been there done that, and against a lower pop then back then, disastrous and more importantly more of the new person popping into either empty towns or hellcamps.

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Kilemall
3 minutes ago, Capco said:

Also, wtf happened last night?  That's the most towns I've seen the Allies take overnight in 2+ years.  

When I signed off, Allied squad ops hitting hard and overwhelming unorganized resistance, plus near as I can tell 95% of the usual TZ3 Axis crew taking the night off, possibly some taking the campaign off in response to the AO adjustment count.

I sill think the pop neutrality stuff is not quite right, doesn't help lowpop enough for real 2:1/3:1 situations in nopop and hits overpop too hard at lower levels.

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Capco
11 hours ago, sydspain said:

Watch for EWS and kill enemy trucks...Isn't that the way this game is supposed to play?

I've said this before: if every person played the game "correctly" and just sat at the map screen waiting for EWS, there'd be no one to actually set off the EWS. 

 

If everyone only played offense, you may never run into another player, but at least towns would be getting captured and the map would be moving.  It still wouldn't be very PvP, but at least there would be some semblance of life in the game.  

 

If everyone only played defense, then nothing happens.  Literally nothing.  

 

It's just a lot easier to stop an attack than it is to get one going, and without good AOs the gameplay is awful.  The more people focus on defense, the worse the game plays out.  The most tense moments in the game are during hotly contested AOs, not autowalking towards truck audios...

 

EDIT:  For the record, it's not a player problem but a game mechanic problem.  Players who stop attacks before they start are in fact playing the game well.  That's the problem:  certain game mechanics encourage this type of behavior.  

Edited by Capco

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sorella
10 minutes ago, Capco said:

Also, wtf happened last night?  That's the most towns I've seen the Allies take overnight in 2+ years.  

tz3 axis were all called up to help the Carolina Hurricanes and Columbus BlueJackets. plus we're sandbagging.

Related image

Related image  

other than that - I think it was excellent work by the old allied crew - stankyus, augetout, and was sw1 there?

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shagher

Axis way underpop this morning TZ3. 

Got up at 5 am to take a look. Axis taking a beating....  One day the game will wake up with zero Axis players. Gonna be a sight.... 

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