kgarner

Spawn delay 30+ secs?

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Is spawn delay going to be shi**y like this during the campaign???? God I hope not.

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Why ? Do You expect to be overpop all the time. Wouldn't be an issue otherwise would it. 

 

 

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SD to 30sec is killer for whatever side gets hit... Consider going back to 10 seconds PLEASE. Why reinstating something that upset players????????????????

 

S!

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After your map roll you deserve a penalty :)

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15 hours ago, goreblimey said:

Why ? Do You expect to be overpop all the time. Wouldn't be an issue otherwise would it. 

 

 

we have 24 players online total, 1 AO and get 25 sec SD while allies cap barle-hertogg

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2 minutes ago, david06 said:

we have 24 players online total, 1 AO and get 25 sec SD while allies cap barle-hertogg

How many Allied players are online?

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now we're up to 30 sec SD with 7 people attacking Geel and 6 defending Baarle-Hertogg

CRS needs to check their math

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Hard to tell without knowing what the actual numbers are.

The problem is that the spawn delay is global (right?), and the problems are always local.

If a 2 full strength Brigades were to attack a half strength Brigade (say a counterattack), then the attackers should be allowed to have 4X as many people, with instant respawning if that was required.

Ie:

The half strength Brigade was just a major attack, and so there are 10 guys still there, they know there will be a counterattack.

The enemy attacks with 2 fresh brigades, but can only manage 15 players to start. They should be allowed to spawn (MSP and a spawnable should they cap one) up to 40 people, since that would represent the relative strength of the attacking vs defending map units. No spawn delay---even if their side was overpop, since locally in this case, they are in fact underpop.

 

 

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euro time zone has really declined, at least years ago when you would get a big operation going on with SD, not a two tiny groups of players in two towns

 

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31 minutes ago, tater said:

Hard to tell without knowing what the actual numbers are.

The problem is that the spawn delay is global (right?), and the problems are always local.

If a 2 full strength Brigades were to attack a half strength Brigade (say a counterattack), then the attackers should be allowed to have 4X as many people, with instant respawning if that was required.

Ie:

The half strength Brigade was just a major attack, and so there are 10 guys still there, they know there will be a counterattack.

The enemy attacks with 2 fresh brigades, but can only manage 15 players to start. They should be allowed to spawn (MSP and a spawnable should they cap one) up to 40 people, since that would represent the relative strength of the attacking vs defending map units. No spawn delay---even if their side was overpop, since locally in this case, they are in fact underpop.

I don't think a spawn gate by supply source is a good idea, at all.

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Cap respawning  weighted to relative Brigade strength (sum AO Brigades on a town vs DO Brigades on town), and have no spawn delays at all, IMHO.

Any units on overpop side that are not allowed to respawn at a depot or MSP have to spawn at the town their Brigade is in (or that Brigade's FB), else move somewhere else on the map (they can spawn aircraft, mount para missions, etc).

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7 minutes ago, Kilemall said:

I don't think a spawn gate by supply source is a good idea, at all.

I think it's literally the only way to link what is supposed to be represented on the "map," with local conditions.

Supply is meaningless. If one side has 2X the players, the supply doesn't matter at all, it makes the whole "big picture" seem silly.

Note that in my idea this only caps linked depot and MSP spawning, not spawning at the town the Brigade is in (depots there) or that AB.

Edited by tater

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Take the example of a big city attack, where you know the enemy is likely underpop.

You'd need to operate under the assumption that if they can only manage a handful of defenders, your attackers have to be careful, since they very well might not be able to respawn to aid the attack if they get killed. So the attack brings as many people as possible, and their losses up to some point are not readily replaced. If the defenders really need to hold the town, they still need to move to town in decent numbers, which increases the attackers ability to respawn in turn. Note again that the initial attacks can be arbitrarily large, this only limits forward spawning.

The attackers would obviously want to mass a few Brigades, since this would increase their relative balance (2X, 3X, 4X the number of defenders would then be possible with MSP/Depot spawning).

If for whatever reason this doesn't allow attacks, add more Brigades to the Map, or more but smaller units, whatever. The point is that the meta units on the map now bear some relation to the actual battles at the player level. Low pop defenders can make a difference if they attrit the attck, because it can become possible for them to face only the odds they SHOULD face, say 2:1, instead of what they might face now (5:1, 10:1).

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So if no defenders turn up, no attackers can attack? And if only a few do, well tough on the other side? So axis can kill Allied Primetime by not defending  other than a few spawning in, and all the excess players either wait for an opening to appear or go play another game for a bit of fun.... wonder what they will pick.

 

Sounds like a recipe to finally kill off the game to me.

 

S! Ian 

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Last night for a period were we got beat out of orval ao and almost lost schilde we had spawn delays starting at 8 and 24 sd about 15 minutes later...maybe in the early stages pop was even but for awhile it “felt” like we were underpop but cant be sure....may be wrong

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13 minutes ago, ian77 said:

So if no defenders turn up, no attackers can attack? And if only a few do, well tough on the other side? So axis can kill Allied Primetime by not defending  other than a few spawning in, and all the excess players either wait for an opening to appear or go play another game for a bit of fun.... wonder what they will pick.

 

Sounds like a recipe to finally kill off the game to me.

If no defenders turn up, the town is taken.

No one has to wait at all, there are no spawn delays.

If a few defenders spawn in, (say 1 v 1 Brigades), then every single enemy they kill cannot quickly resume the fight, they have to go elsewhere, or spawn at the FB.

I propose no limits on spawning from FBs and towns at all. Only MSPs and linked Depots.

Worst case your attackers, facing a handful of defenders have to spawn in at the FB, and ride a truck into town... or they could take a tank.

 

Edited by tater

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4 hours ago, hafgan said:

No, but I pay to play-- not pay to wait.

So do I. Specifically, smgs.

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So when spawn delays are set to the kind of number that might prevent overpop rolls, people want to rage quit on the attacking (overpop) side---which actually might reduce the overpop, but in a bad way.

When spawn delays are meaninglessly short, it doesn't have much of an effect on attacks at all, and towns roll, or rapidly become unfun camps for the defenders, making THEM want to rage quit, which exacerbates the overpop (which is never good).

I can't see any way to reduce overpop short of the game assigning players to sides as needed, and even then, if players are deciding where they will attack/defend, local overpop will be a situation independent of the "Map" level game (everyone on a side can spawn in with a Garrison force, and still roll towns with full Brigades in them, 50 guys all at once vs 5 wins, every time).

So the solution need to be one that is not painful to, well, anyone, if possible.

My idea seems like a starting point, since it can't be worse than doing nothing, or cranking spawn delays into 10s of seconds (last campaign I saw the "Join Axis" timer in the Persona window at what was it, 14 minutes? (or was it just 4---I posted about it)).

 

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4 hours ago, hafgan said:

No, but I pay to play-- not pay to wait.

Then play on the underpop side so you don’t have to wait.

 

If you want to club baby seals, you’re gonna have to wait first.

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Spawn delay will never correct side balance issues. There needs to be incentive, not punishment. 

That said, I do understand the need to do something -- but this is pretty dramatic. 

 

3 minutes ago, Capco said:

Then play on the underpop side so you don’t have to wait.

 

If you want to club baby seals, you’re gonna have to wait first.

Don't forget this sword has two edges on it. 

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1 minute ago, Randazzo said:

Don't forget this sword has two edges on it. 

If the Allies become the overpop side and this ends up hurting them more, that’s still a win for the Allies.

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