tater

Hey Rats, what changes are _possible_?

47 posts in this topic

11 minutes ago, tater said:

 

Boring. A good persistent, DFMS setup could be something that requires an attacker to deal with in a way that's actually, you know, an ATTACK.

 

And the eis will still "infiltrate" and your handful of defenders will now be 2 or 3,000m further away from town, probably spawning at a camped DFMS if found rather than blown, while the eis are back in town capping. Unmanned DFMS's wont stop the attackers from driving to the AO and getting into town, and you will still have to respond to the EWS that pops up in every single players chat window, or lose the town. You need to think of the negative aspects of your ideas as well as the positive. Having a "frontline" and some further out satellite CPs seems more workable to me.

 

S!

 

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The gun crew is not just the two men pushing the gun - it is represented by them, the gunner at the sights would be correcting aim and tracking the target while the loaders load. A better question rather than the gunner loading and firing would be how a gun is pushed through thick bush lines in complete silence and has 50+ rounds to fire.  ATGs are not hunters. 

Edited by ian77
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17 minutes ago, ian77 said:

Having a "frontline" and some further out satellite CPs seems more workable to me.

 

I'm all for that, but it seems vastly harder to get added to  the game. This thread is about what could be added without a magical increase in subs, etc. Small changes to existing stuff...

10 minutes ago, ian77 said:

The gun crew is not just the two men pushing the gun - it is represented by them, the gunner at the sights would be correcting aim and tracking the target while the loaders load. A better question rather than the gunner loading and firing would be how a gun is pushed through thick bush lines in complete silence and has 50+ rounds to fire.  ATGs are not hunters. 

The guns drive around hunting because it was the only way to get them out of town to the places where any commander would have placed them the day he got to the town to defend it.

It all goes to the spawn at a point in town paradigm, where the troops should spawn in the field (including ATGs). The attackers would have to then go back oldschool, and tow guns, or a truck can spawn an ATG MSP that only has a couple guns, (and the ammo that it could carry for them). The guns would then not be able to move much, and would not have loads of ready ammo, they'd have to be near the ATG MSP (perhaps designed to shield them, like a giant foxhole object vs the FMS).

Anyway, since ATGs on defense (where they would likely be most effective) are required by gameplay to be reactive, they have to move too fast, and have to carry too much ammo.

Another kooky idea (part of it I proposed in another thread maybe):

If there is no AO, defensive ATGs can move at a super fast rate of speed over the ground, like inf running, but no stamina issue. They can only do this within some distance of a friendly facility. If there IS an AO, then attacking units can drive their ATGs at this fast speed, with with a long exclusion zone from an enemy facility/town. This is to encourage setting the AO BEFORE attacking, instead of after FMS are in place, and ei already running in, or actually in town.

Once the AO is set the defensive ATGs drop to an incredibly slow speed, slower than they move now. They have very little ammo (I'm thinking a handful of rounds), as well, but within some range of a truck or friendly facility, they get resupplied (as an ammo box does now, but perhaps at a slower rate. Like they get dosed a couple shells, then a long time lag, then a couple more. They can build up extra shells (oversupply), but if they move more than a couple meters they are back down to their super low ammo, and have to build up supply again.

So the truck or facility (or FMS?) distance might be much farther than current resupply, but much more metered (2 shells every few minutes, it's an abstraction of runners bringing ammo). Maybe the closer the truck/CP, the faster the reloading (time between reloads added is the distance in meters divided by something in seconds?). The idea here is that the artillery can be placed, but not easily moved, and as long as it stays put, it can have ammo supply build up.

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15 hours ago, tater said:

I'm torn by this, frankly. I'd like that to be the case, but then again, the gun crew should also not be limited to only doing one job or the other. You could not load and aim at the same time, but with one 1 gunner you could load, then aim, then fire, right?

If they spend any work on the AAA/ATGs, I'd make it so that infantry can join a gun if the crew is dead, if the gun was still functional. A gun that gets sprayed with MG fire might no longer have a crew, but the GUN is just fine, and any nearby infantry could simply man it as required.

The same goes for tank crews, BTW, if 1 guy is killed, was it possible for someone to swap places at all? If yes, then that should be a thing as well.

I'd use that opportunity to let players take over the AI as well...

Also, gun crews should be able to seek cover (during which time they can't shoot the gun, obviously).

They need the small arms they all carried, as well.

I would call it an abstraction that represents the fact that guns are too easy to take out, and cannot be remanned.

But a gun getting sprayed by MG fire there is no crew left cause they abandon the gun as fast as their little feet can carry them. 

In game I have sprayed various guns with belts < look at the S  and fired AP and HE rounds at them to either have them play possum or watch them set up and one shot me , Happens to me on both end of the spectrum Allied as Axis .

But when I'm ATG one plink does my gunner in from a Rifle .

Set up a LMG less then 50 meters see the Camle AAA pushed right in front of me 50 round side to side sweep and the guy sets up and kills me all that while his gunner is receiving the 2nd belt of 50 rounds cause why aim at the commander anymore he just did set up while he should actually have more kneecaps to stand on .

Trust me every ATG I see gets HE upside the head or AP rounds while I'm shooting them they would not be of much use anymore .

I use always both with rather mixed results.

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13 minutes ago, dre21 said:

But a gun getting sprayed by MG fire there is no crew left cause they abandon the gun as fast as their little feet can carry them. 

No, I agree, but I think that crewed weapons need to have an ability to seek cover, abandon their guns, etc.

13 minutes ago, dre21 said:

In game I have sprayed various guns with belts < look at the S  and fired AP and HE rounds at them to either have them play possum or watch them set up and one shot me , Happens to me on both end of the spectrum Allied as Axis .

But when I'm ATG one plink does my gunner in from a Rifle .

LOL, me, too. I shoot a rifle, LMG, whatever at an ATG/AAA, and it never dies, meanwhile, i'f the ATG is me, I've literally been killed by an SMG firing from a window at 400m in a Camle.

13 minutes ago, dre21 said:

Set up a LMG less then 50 meters see the Camle AAA pushed right in front of me 50 round side to side sweep and the guy sets up and kills me all that while his gunner is receiving the 2nd belt of 50 rounds cause why aim at the commander anymore he just did set up while he should actually have more kneecaps to stand on .

It always feels weird, I agree. This is a huge problem in general, because it feeds the idea there is some bias, when if we all talk about it, we all see the same thing on both sides. As an ATG/AAA I seem to die to pretty much anything, yet I have shot at them, and had no effect. FWIW, many times as a camle, I have the gunner dead, and I undeploy and run back to RTB the thing to not waste it.

13 minutes ago, dre21 said:

Trust me every ATG I see gets HE upside the head or AP rounds while I'm shooting them they would not be of much use anymore .

I use always both with rather mixed results.

Yeah, I'm all for rounds hitting them that would wreck the weapon wrecking the weapon. I'm just saying everything about them in game is kinda wrong on all levels. A short list:

1. The move too fast, and carry too much ammo, which lets them...

2. They drive around hunting, like tanks. This is largely because...

2a. The spawn paradigm places weapons that should be out in the field in the middle of town, and since all defenses are reactive, they need to unrealistically move fast to ever leave the spawn points.

2b. They have too much ammo for the same reason, they are not pre-positioned with ammo someplace, they have to carry it, since there is no mechanism to visibly resupply them.

3. The crew can only each do 1 job, so losing any crew effectively kills the weapon.

4. The crew also cannot seek cover, the gun is not suppressed, it runs away, gets killed, or stays effective.

5. New crew cannot join.

6. Too easy to spot, no good physical cover (or emplacements).

7. Too hard to spot (6 and 7 are both true, lol).

8. No noise moving.

9. While 8 is true, they have zero defense against ei, when all the crew should in fact be armed.

10. ? (I'm sure there's more).

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On 6/11/2019 at 0:38 PM, Augetout said:

I think a good clue as to what is feasible given the resources can be found in the roadmap, and in the in-game polls.

I will say this:  If the current version of CRS had anything resembling the resources the original crew did, this game would improve by leaps and bounds in a quick fashion.  I'm not denigrating the original CRS crew by saying that.  The current CRS has the ability/willingness to learn from the 18 years of development to this game.  All that is currently lacking is the proper amount of resources to get all that CRS wants done, accomplished.

All in all, this is still the best game I've ever played, and the best gaming community I have ever dealt with.  The passion of community members is clearly visible, and most (not all) approach this game as it should be approached:  Warts and all, the best WW2 game ever, still looking to get better.

CRS has never been more responsive to the community, and has never shown the willingness the current bunch has shown to make changes (resources allowing), to improve the in-game experience of all players.

I'll leave specific answers to those far more qualified than I to answer them.

S!

This is spot on and greatly appreciated. We could, and are willing to do, so much more if we can simply purchase the time of our developers and get them here and dedicated on a full time basis. That is our desire.

I hope that the community as a whole recognizes just how special it is, what we have here, WWII Online, and despite those grumblings and things that come up, remain steadfast in their support morally and with their subscription. Those two things make the total difference and can not only help us go onwards into the future, but actually do real development that has a good return for all.

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_possible_?
(After already spawned in)
1. Warp player to new location.
2. Transform player to different vehicle/infantry.

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No warping of players , this is not Star Trek online.

Besides the warp we already have from a FMS to a close captured CP , which I still to this day don't understand why it works with certain CPs , that are not spawnables. 

 

@tater  

It would be great if the ATG and AAA would get a entrench PPO mechanism. 

Kinda like you find your spot , do either a . dot command like .entrench and it gives one an option of 3 builds if different PPOs  that one can pick depending on what kind of terrain one is on.

Once you undeploy the PPO goes away and you are free to move again . Of course there is a build time and disassemble time before you can freely move again .

Just an idea.

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1 hour ago, dre21 said:

It would be great if the ATG and AAA would get a entrench PPO mechanism. 

Kinda like you find your spot , do either a . dot command like .entrench and it gives one an option of 3 builds if different PPOs  that one can pick depending on what kind of terrain one is on.

Once you undeploy the PPO goes away and you are free to move again . Of course there is a build time and disassemble time before you can freely move again .

Just an idea.

Agreed. Perhaps a few things added to make the ATG more survivable, but also alter the paradigm that has ATG patrolling around as mobile hunters.

1. ATGs get effective cover/concealment as you suggest as PPOs (rural, sandbag, and perhaps even a rubble version)

2. Build time for these new PPOs is substantial. Goal is that while moving around (hunting), it's not really doable. Current inf show standing with e-tools for a build, have it so when an ATG is making a PPO, a few static inf with e-tools appear all around the ATG a few meters. Doing this is harder to hide...

3. ATG ammo supply if simply deployed is massively lowered, and increases to the current levels only with PPO placement.

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On 09/07/2019 at 6:40 PM, ian77 said:

So dont sit on defense all night, take turns guarding, or better yet get on the AO - way too many turtles in game these days, just ask Matamor! :) 

Turtles never won a single campaign. You are right ian77!

S!

 

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27 minutes ago, matamor said:

Turtles never won a single campaign. You are right ian77!

S!

 

I disagree, if when  up and you know soon ( in hour or 2) you wil be even or op, gonig turlte and  not just bluntin gan attack but atritting the attackers equip/ will alow a  counter attack of sometimes devisataig effectiveness.

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On 7/11/2019 at 8:12 AM, dre21 said:

No warping of players , this is not Star Trek online.

Were it possible, you could control multiple characters.
 
1. Place token in world to represent the unit the player is jumping out of.
 
2. Delete the token of the inactive unit in world the player is jumping into.
 
3. Warp the player to the location of above no.2
 
3. Transform the player to the type of unit no .2  was
 
In this way, a player could control multiple characters, one at a time.

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6 hours ago, drkmouse said:

I disagree, if when  up and you know soon ( in hour or 2) you wil be even or op, gonig turlte and  not just bluntin gan attack but atritting the attackers equip/ will alow a  counter attack of sometimes devisataig effectiveness.

Sorry to tell you this directly but Santa Claus never existed. 

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19 minutes ago, matamor said:

Sorry to tell you this directly but Santa Claus never existed. 

And what does st nickolaus have to do with counter attacks?  his reindeer have vendetas?

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2 hours ago, matamor said:

Sorry to tell you this directly but Santa Claus never existed. 

Wait....what?

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45 minutes ago, Jsilec said:

Wait....what?

Quebequers sarcasm. 

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21 minutes ago, matamor said:

Quebequers sarcasm. 

Image result for santa claus in quebec meme

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29 minutes ago, matamor said:

Quebequers sarcasm. 

Ok cuz I thought you said santa wasnt real and that bs dont fly here because i getting a rangers jersey from him this year with the name Kakko on it....santa always delivers !

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3 hours ago, Jsilec said:

Ok cuz I thought you said santa wasnt real and that bs dont fly here because i getting a rangers jersey from him this year with the name Kakko on it....santa always delivers !

I seen santa,  my wife sat in lap and they talked about the first thing to come up....

 

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On 7/18/2019 at 5:38 PM, trilobite said:
Were it possible, you could control multiple characters.
 
1. Place token in world to represent the unit the player is jumping out of.
 
2. Delete the token of the inactive unit in world the player is jumping into.
 
3. Warp the player to the location of above no.2
 
3. Transform the player to the type of unit no .2  was
 
In this way, a player could control multiple characters, one at a time.

15 years ago or more I wrote my most responded to post which was titled "Spawning Multiple Units, the Answer to Everything" or something to that effect. Got like over 100 responses, though I might be misremembering. It would be great for having ready defenses, and you might be able to have pure kill-the-enemy gameplay, rather than flag capture.

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3 hours ago, blggles said:

15 years ago or more I wrote my most responded to post which was titled "Spawning Multiple Units, the Answer to Everything" or something to that effect. Got like over 100 responses, though I might be misremembering. It would be great for having ready defenses, and you might be able to have pure kill-the-enemy gameplay, rather than flag capture.

I probbaly posted and agreed to it, I have made similar posts about a sort of player controlled "AI" where the player has inf that "follow the leader," and the player can serially take them over for aimed fire. They would all have a minor shooting as AI capability at some very short range, in the direction they were facing (determined by the player, obviously).

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The real hold up to anything is time. At the moment there are a crap-ton of things in the pipeline, but having a coder available to get it in game is the hangup.  As an example, on the web-side of things I've gone from having 25-30 hours a week to having about 3-4 due to my day job.  This has resulted in a slow down of all things web-side.   The same issue happens on the development and production fronts, person A joins, spends a few months familiarizing with the code, then life seems to pull them away. 

Hence the incessant drumbeat for subscriptions - with enough subs we can pay a dedicated coder for more than (at best) part-time attention and build momentum a bit quicker.   

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