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World War II Online is a Massively Multiplayer Online First Person Shooter based in Western Europe between 1939 and 1943. Through land, sea, and air combat using a ultra-realistic game engine, combined with a strategic layer, in the largest game world ever created - We offer the best WWII simulation experience around.

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1.36.6.0 - Review Request

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griffon

 

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stankyus

The thing that strikes me about some of the gun cams from some of these really good pilots is how smooth their targeting is. Mine looks a lot like yours Griffon. Its all over the place and my air war is very similar to the first few minutes of this video.  I have no idea how these guys make it look so easy.. tho I did get a kill on Halsey last map once.. er mb it was the one before that when he was flying Axis.

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texasjay

Good job Griffon, This video tell it all , Did anyone notice the DM on allied aircraft,, This the reason I stop flying , it not worth it going after 3 -4 fight on one plane ,

Still need fix on DM so I can go back in air .

 

 

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griffon

Yeah my gunnery has never been pretty baha.. also went through death of last 3dpro (its trigger and rudder) and switched to a hot as for first time ever... im defintly 'off' in a few of these clips. 

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XOOM

Thanks for the vids @griffon, recommend you activate that Windows btw ;)

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griffon

Ha. Cpu was built not by me plan to get it looked at more professionally real soon. ( I cleared a virus off her and uh since then have had windows activation and I dont think all the hardware is talking to itself like it should). Video has been going up as we go along as I only have so much storage. Will continue to post as I gain footage and time to edit. 

Really even all the German gun cam footage is still a small sample size! 

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griffon

I'll say this though. Several times I had to trim all the way left or right and hold js all the way left or right just to kinda fly still after taking hits. Im not seeing that loss of control from the allied airplanes. Even in that 190 clip on the db7 where it absorbs all my ammo its engines give out and the plane lands on the ground still in control and maneuvering still. I guess im asking in a way if this has been expierenced by allied pilots post patch as i haven't seen from my view yet.

The difference between the two sides pre patch was how well the guns worked on one side vs the other (and pls dont try to tell me otherwise). Seems to be thats still the case, one sides work better than the others. 

 

Which brings me to another long standing gripe. From what I understand one of the advantages of cannon over machine gun was effective range. It should be longer not shorter. Im not talking trajectory though the skies as I've seen people mix that up im talking about its physical range. 

Edited by griffon
Typo like always ha

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griffon

Already found film of planes fighting not to go in now that I said that. Cannon range is still a question of mine.thx.

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Scotsman
On 9/10/2020 at 5:01 PM, texasjay said:

Good job Griffon, This video tell it all , Did anyone notice the DM on allied aircraft,, This the reason I stop flying , it not worth it going after 3 -4 fight on one plane ,

Still need fix on DM so I can go back in air .

 

 

All the damage models are fixed and as close to,live fire testing as can be made..

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griffon

 

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texasjay
On ‎9‎/‎14‎/‎2020 at 2:11 AM, Scotsman said:

All the damage models are fixed and as close to,live fire testing as can be made..

So you said it fix  and think it okay? Have you watch the video ? allied taking whole dump truck load ammo and still flying and  our plane  only take a flea shot n die .

Matter fact it took 5 of us 190 to shoot down one ea and no it not fix , I am sorry I ain't buying that fix thing , We are here to prove that something ain't right .

You think anyone want play n pay 100 hit to make a kill and we  die 1 shot ? just saying but fact is true, Btw I report it before and yall didn't believe me

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chzacc

I may have watched a different video there, I didnt actually see much of his ammo hit the plane, must be my eyes getting old

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Scotsman
21 minutes ago, texasjay said:

So you said it fix  and think it okay? Have you watch the video ? allied taking whole dump truck load ammo and still flying and  our plane  only take a flea shot n die .

Matter fact it took 5 of us 190 to shoot down one ea and no it not fix , I am sorry I ain't buying that fix thing , We are here to prove that something ain't right .

You think anyone want play n pay 100 hit to make a kill and we  die 1 shot ? just saying but fact is true, Btw I report it before and yall didn't believe me

What part of light air frame do you not understand? The 109 and spit are both lightweights and somewhat fragile damage wise. Their damage models are not that different in terms of energy. I suspect sone of the issue is ammo belting again which I do not control. I know it’s being reviewed.

You have to be able to separate cause and effect. If it’s a belting issue that has nothing to do with the damage model. 

Will you have to adjust game play? Probably...hurricanes and p-40 are tougher now consistent with their air frame weight. 

You might do well to read the allied pilots complaining that the 190 is too hard to bring down with 50 cal....hence the moves to normalize AP. The belting between the early 109 20mm and the 190 20mm is not the same. 

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texasjay

Scottman, I understand a lot of thing that doesn't look right ,, if it was right I wouldn't be here,

I know 20mm between 109 and 190 20mm are different load out .the problem is the penetrated is not doing any damage ,Ap, mine and heat  seem to be too weak

I know Hurricane are tough sob but come on it like shooting fly tank , same thing with DB7 ,

They complain about 50 cal , lol , they thing are laser beam n does the killing pretty good ..

Watch the video scottman , maybe you might see the different ,, take hammer and sledgehammer , which one hurt the most

 

 

 

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Scotsman
49 minutes ago, texasjay said:

Scottman, I understand a lot of thing that doesn't look right ,, if it was right I wouldn't be here,

I know 20mm between 109 and 190 20mm are different load out .the problem is the penetrated is not doing any damage ,Ap, mine and heat  seem to be too weak

I know Hurricane are tough sob but come on it like shooting fly tank , same thing with DB7 ,

They complain about 50 cal , lol , they thing are laser beam n does the killing pretty good ..

Watch the video scottman , maybe you might see the different ,, take hammer and sledgehammer , which one hurt the most

 

 

 

Well thats the RAF damage repair records indicate for hurricane. It could soak up 20mm hits... the spitfire couldn't thanks to its construction. It was also much easier to repair, and faster to rearm, than the spitfire. You shouldn't expect AP to do a lot to hurricane because there isn't much there under the skins to hit that is not fail soft to other structural members. 3-4 20mm hits will do in a spitfire typically...the hurricane will require more. Link below shows a bomb damaged hurricane that flew again. That's far more joules than an aircraft cannon can dream of delivering. You are exactly right. They were tough...

https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=NQ7fcIK5&id=75390368468718FFBE92E706369F266488D1F7AD&thid=OIP.NQ7fcIK5tCOrrNUAyM_Y4AHaDX&mediaurl=https%3a%2f%2fexternal-preview.redd.it%2fmVFih6t_YmSr2_EnOHGaUrCnaMz46YmHvL_8uUFj1zw.jpg%3fwidth%3d1000%26auto%3dwebp%26s%3d7e742bf2cb3178d3d5954981ff71cd4da49af3e4&exph=454&expw=1000&q=damaged+hurricane+RAF&simid=608025910242903267&ck=814552C248ECBEC181409834DDCF647E&selectedIndex=1&FORM=IRPRST&ajaxhist=0

The DB-7 was also tough....radial engines and a moderately heavy air frame make it so, but Its not hard to down assuming you get the tail or wing roots. There are damage pics with it's entire upper fuselage blown off and still flying. 

Nothing was changed on the ammo side...and the damage model is consistent between engagements with the two different 20mm weapons....so it comes down to ammo belting and what you are hitting in all probability. 

Again...you can't go by what you did with the old damage model. It was 'bad' in many ways. The new model aligns with both live fire testing and gun camera that was reviewed. Its not perfect, but far better than what we had.  

I'm listening and looking but so far it seems like both sides are crying a wee bit, never having had real validated damage models to play with. The allies are saying 50 cal are weak yet I see nothing wrong in the videos griffon posted. The Axis are claiming there is an issue with the 20mm. The newer cannon hits harder in joules than the older model but its ammo belting is different. In the video I have seen I see nothing that screaming at me beyond the belt difference.

Knowing what the old values were vs. the new values I guess I am not surprised. 

In summary, the new damage model (unlike the old) --does-- care about what you hit and how hard. Rather than generic fail levels everything now has its own independently calculated component levels. 

 

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griffon

The issue is the german cannons have no range and they should have ranges comparable to the .50s. 

Makes the p38 pretty much impossible to fight if you fly it to its strengths. They have great range. We have none. The 30mm range is even more of a joke. 

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Scotsman
On 9/17/2020 at 5:14 PM, griffon said:

The issue is the german cannons have no range and they should have ranges comparable to the .50s. 

Makes the p38 pretty much impossible to fight if you fly it to its strengths. They have great range. We have none. The 30mm range is even more of a joke. 

The 30mm was a pretty low velocity cannon (540 m/s)...a bomber killer....the German 20mm velocities are right where they should be for their proper penetration and range. I'm unsure how you can say they have no range when the velocity is at spec. MGFF is 600-700 m/s depending on ammo and that's significantly slower than the 50 cal. M2 Ball for the 50 is better than 850 m/s. 

You seem to be complaining about facts... velocity is a simple physical fact and it cares not for feelings, emotions, or perception. 

So if these velocities are correct then what you seem to be taking issue with is the design features of the weapon and ammunition. I do believe the complaint department of the third Reich is closed these days...so I am unsure what you would have us do other than input the specification for the ammunition. 

I will never do 'fantasy' physics when it comes to ammo for either side. You get what the weapon and ammo did....nothing more...nothing less. 

 

Edited by Scotsman

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griffon
4 minutes ago, Scotsman said:

The 30mm was a pretty low velocity cannon (540 m/s)...a bomber killer....the German 20mm velocities are right where they should be for their proper penetration and range. I'm unsure how you can say they have no range when the velocity is at spec. MGFF is 600-700 m/s depending on ammo and that's significantly slower than the 50 cal. M2 Ball for the 50 is better than 850 m/s. 

You seem to be complaining about facts... velocity is a simple physical fact and it cares not for feelings, emotions, or perception. 

So if these velocities are correct then what you seem to be taking issue with is the design features of the weapon and ammunition. I do believe the complain department of the third Reich is closed these days...so I am unsure what you would have us do other than input the specification for the ammunition. 

I will never do 'fantasy' physics when it comes to ammo for either side. You get what the weapon and ammo did....nothing more...nothing less. 

 

Range and velocity are two different things.

Two different things! Lol!

Your cannons explode incredibly early deneying me the ability to reach anywhere near close to what my enemy can. Maybe a 1/4 of my enemys range and that is far from how it was. 

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griffon

The velocity of an object is the rate of change of its position with respect to a frame of reference, and is a function of time. Velocity is equivalent to a specification of an object's speed and direction of motion (e.g. 60 km/h to the north). Velocity is a fundamental concept in kinematics, the branch of classical mechanics that describes the motion of bodies.

Velocity is a physical vector quantity; both magnitude and direction are needed to define it. The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is called speed, being a coherent derived unit whose quantity is measured in the SI (metric system) as metres per second (m/s) or as the SI base unit of (m⋅s−1). For example, "5 metres per second" is a scalar, whereas "5 metres per second east" is a vector. If there is a change in speed, direction or both, then the object has a changing velocity and is said to be undergoing an acceleration.

One defination of Range is 

a(1): the horizontal distance to which a projectile can be propelled
(2): the horizontal distance between a weapon and target

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griffon

1115.jpg

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griffon

In Lame Mans Terms, I am quite alright with HOW my cannons fire, However I am quite upset with how early they explode considering the Germans used Contact Fuses and Often Mine Fuses which imbedded slightly and ripped the plane apart in 3-5 20mm cannon shells for single engine fighter plane. (Source, Hurricane Messerschmitt. Book) 

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chzacc

I think he is getting confused with the ammunition that is used. ie he sees the cannon shell explode before it reaches the target, as far as i know the cannon shells that were used where contact and not proximity/timed

they shouldnt explode if they dont hit anything

Edited by chzacc

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Scotsman
31 minutes ago, griffon said:

In Lame Mans Terms, I am quite alright with HOW my cannons fire, However I am quite upset with how early they explode considering the Germans used Contact Fuses and Often Mine Fuses which imbedded slightly and ripped the plane apart in 3-5 20mm cannon shells for single engine fighter plane. (Source, Hurricane Messerschmitt. Book) 

Fusing can be changed...and the HE rounds do have their proper penetration constants. I can't recall the delay they are currently set for but as best as I can recall in testing they were exploding internal to the structure just fine. The fusing (if memory serves) is not instantaneous in the data for 20mm but has a slight delay....and skins are now sufficiently thin to insure penetration in all cases. 

As for what mine does to a single engine...we have that test data....and the 20mm mine does what it should do...I've already told you 3-4 hits kills a spitfire in all testing...which is in complete agreement with your quote. A p-40, however, is not a spitfire. Nor is a hurricane a spitfire. They are different animals although they all have wings. 

 

28 minutes ago, chzacc said:

I think he is getting confused with the ammunition that is used. ie he sees the cannon shell explode before it reaches the target, as far as i know the cannon shells that were used where contact and not proximity/timed

they shouldnt explode if they dont hit anything

It’s contact fused with a delay.. 

Edited by Scotsman

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chzacc

so how come they explode in mid air without hitting anything ?

 

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james10

Because most HE rounds in-game self destruct after about 2 seconds of flight, especially for aircraft and AA weapons.

Cheers

Edited by james10

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