FRUs part 2

[mattwitt]

Firstly could you point me in the direction of the complaint forum? You know the one that your threads don't get locked or deleted when ever you are critical of CRS.

As for specifics with bugs.

If you make a mission to attack a town and then go to that town and set a FRU, it seems that once the town is contested and your FRU goes down you are unable to make a new one, you get some message that says "BadTarget?RangeToFar?"

To get around that first bug you do not make the target for the town, you make the target a CP/AB in town. Generally speaking the AB is used. However, this presents a problem in larger towns. As it seems if you make your target for one AB on one side of town, but then the attack progresses and you move your FRU to attack the other AB, the system only does a range check on the AB you made the target of your mission. So you are able to place your FRU pretty much right next to the other AB.

Also on the same issue, if in extremely large towns, such as antwerp it is possible to have a CP or AB targeted but be unable to make a FRU at certain parts of town because it is too far away from the target of your mission. IE you can not target the AF AB in Antwerp and then deploy a FRU at the NAB. This may or may not be WAD, but is quite the flaw considering if you could make the target Antwerp, without fear of your FRU becoming bugged. You would be able to place a FRU wherever in town.

Also there is no min distance range restrictions on placing a FRU at an FB.They can be and are quite often placed right next to the tents.

With the max range being 3k now which is nearly double what the max range with MSPs was, it is actually possible in some towns to not even own the FB but be able to place a FRU at the town you are attacking. This is done by targeting the enemy FB and simply driving around it until you reach the max range from the FB and you can then place the FRU and attack town.

That is it off the top of my head, I've not exactly gone around doing any bug hunting, these are just the glaringly obvious ones that jump out to me and just about anyone who has played the game a decent amount.

Maybe we could leave this thread open so that people can add in other bugs they've noticed and we can have them all neat and ordered in one thread.

[AHWULF]

Open Beta?

[mattwitt]

Open Beta?

I swore I've been logging into that for the past few weeks

[AHWULF]

The open beta has lots of FRU changes but not enough testers.

[alexande]

thank you mattwitt. All the tests and workarounds you have done explain to me why I find axis frus in places that I know they should not be. It also explains why I have had and have seen players experience insane amounts of bugs trying to place these fru's in intuitive logical ways.

this is by far the most complete explanation of how to use the frus that I have ever seen by the way, including workarounds to make them more effective and dangerous.

Edited December 5, 2010 by alexande

[mattwitt]

thank you mattwitt. All the tests and workarounds you have done explain to me why I find axis frus in places that I know they should not be. It also explains why I have had and have seen players experience insane amounts of bugs trying to place these fru's in intuitive logical ways.

this is by far the most complete explanation of how to use the frus that I have ever seen by the way, including workarounds to make them more effective and dangerous.

If you think I am saying that people are intentionally trying to cheat and take advantage of a bug you have misread what I've said. People place the FRUs when the FRUs show they are green and they can place them.

[mattwitt]

The open beta has lots of FRU changes but not enough testers.

too big of a download for me to mess with for beta, last time I tried to download a beta patch I got disconnected from the download server, had to start all over and then when I got it downloaded I loaded up one time and then the next time I went to play it required a new download.

[DOC]

now that you added some detail to your report it has become quite useful, so thanks!

[mattwitt]

now that you added some detail to your report it has become quite useful' date=' so thanks![/quote']

you're welcome

Edited December 5, 2010 by mattwitt
're derp

[noons]

I swore I've been logging into that for the past few weeks

I with you matt. I think I am on the open beta almost every day. The other open beta should be called the open c______ (need help on the greek alphabet here)

Anyway I have also been shown that a Air BDE HQ can land a sapper from that HQ anywhere on the map and launch a "magic box" that opens for 2.5 seconds to allow very quick clickers to simul launch into the world. Now I know it faces limited supply and the fru has timers to stop you placing one every five seconds but theoretically I could get the squad I play with to do this for lets say a factory town and go sapper all your factories. I can imagine the threads about that if it happened.

I don't think its in the spirit of the game but if there is an "easter egg" in the game atm then this takes the prize.

S! mattwitt for your honesty about the bugs and allowing the allied players to learn from the axis wisdom

;-)

[noons]

PS just read FRU's part 1.

Probably the most insightful post since "I go."

ROFLMAO

[mattwitt]

I with you matt. I think I am on the open beta almost every day. The other open beta should be called the open c______ (need help on the greek alphabet here)

Anyway I have also been shown that a Air BDE HQ can land a sapper from that HQ anywhere on the map and launch a "magic box" that opens for 2.5 seconds to allow very quick clickers to simul launch into the world. Now I know it faces limited supply and the fru has timers to stop you placing one every five seconds but theoretically I could get the squad I play with to do this for lets say a factory town and go sapper all your factories. I can imagine the threads about that if it happened.

I don't think its in the spirit of the game but if there is an "easter egg" in the game atm then this takes the prize.

S! mattwitt for your honesty about the bugs and allowing the allied players to learn from the axis wisdom

;-)

I'm pretty sure the issues I mentioned are well known on both sides, because they are very common. If you are implying that the Axis are more aware of bugs and trying to use them to their advantage then that is incorrect, I have seen bugged FRUs from both sides.

[noons]

I'm pretty sure the issues I mentioned are well known on both sides' date=' because they are very common. If you are implying that the Axis are more aware of bugs and trying to use them to their advantage then that is incorrect, I have seen bugged FRUs from both sides.[/quote']

No not implying anything but if people know about them on the allied side then it is within a squad level and the Anzacs certainly haven't been talking about them or using them to the best of my knowledge. There are squads and players on both sides who are always pushing the envelope so to speak.

I am just glad that this post is here for everyone to learn and the accusations can go away. As DOC has said in another post this is part of the big picture for the game. I've been playing for 8 years and all the changes have kept it fresh when essentially we have been battling over the same turf for most of that time.

So apologies if I have offended you none was meant.

[mattwitt]

No not implying anything but if people know about them on the allied side then it is within a squad level and the Anzacs certainly haven't been talking about them or using them to the best of my knowledge. There are squads and players on both sides who are always pushing the envelope so to speak.

I am just glad that this post is here for everyone to learn and the accusations can go away. As DOC has said in another post this is part of the big picture for the game. I've been playing for 8 years and all the changes have kept it fresh when essentially we have been battling over the same turf for most of that time.

So apologies if I have offended you none was meant.

Ah all good, but no I don't get offended I just have a fetish for trying to clarify misconceptions.

and of course argue with Aussies

[HuskerGI]

So is someone going to fix the bug where you can spawn from a FRU no matter where you put it?

I mean, either fix the 2 second "magic" spawn time from ANY fru or post it in the start page of the game like you did with para INTO the FB tents.

That seemed to work and stop people for the most part. Make it a banable issue until it is fixed or EVERYONE is going to start looking into more.

Thanks for your time. I understand you are very busy at this point. Must be Christmas coming or something.

[GOPHUR]

If you make a mission to attack a town and then go to that town and set a FRU, it seems that once the town is contested and your FRU goes down you are unable to make a new one, you get some message that says "BadTarget?RangeToFar?"

This is partially fixed in beta. When your target goes down your mission target is no longer valid so you can;t place an MSP there. This was true with truck MSPs before as well.

To get around that first bug you do not make the target for the town, you make the target a CP/AB in town. Generally speaking the AB is used. However, this presents a problem in larger towns. As it seems if you make your target for one AB on one side of town, but then the attack progresses and you move your FRU to attack the other AB, the system only does a range check on the AB you made the target of your mission. So you are able to place your FRU pretty much right next to the other AB.

Can I get a specific example. I have been trying unsuccessfully to replicate this in beta. Here's my test case:

• create a mission attacking an enemy owned Antwerp
• target the southern ab
  
• parameters for FRU placement should be
  
  • within 3000m of your target (in this case the southern ab)
  • 400m away from any enemy facility (this includes the other abs at antewrp, all owned by the enemy)
    

  [*]What did I see

  • when I got 3km from the SAB I could place the FRU - correct
    
  • When I got on the AF tile I could not place the FRU - correct
    
  • When I was 400m away from target I could not place FRU - correct
    

  [*]Then I'll approach the CAB from the south

  • there are no facilities within 400m and I can place the FRU - correct
  • I can find no place within 400m of the CAB that I can place the FRU - Correct
    

I'm going to need a better report than any I've been given to track this bug down.

Also on the same issue, if in extremely large towns, such as antwerp it is possible to have a CP or AB targeted but be unable to make a FRU at certain parts of town because it is too far away from the target of your mission. IE you can not target the AF AB in Antwerp and then deploy a FRU at the NAB. This may or may not be WAD, but is quite the flaw considering if you could make the target Antwerp, without fear of your FRU becoming bugged. You would be able to place a FRU wherever in town.

no change sinece the truck MSP AFAIK. Missions haev never been properly used with origins and targets and that is something we'll change when we go group focused spawning with dynamic origins and targets.

Also there is no min distance range restrictions on placing a FRU at an FB.They can be and are quite often placed right next to the tents.

Fixed in beta, please test.

With the max range being 3k now which is nearly double what the max range with MSPs was, it is actually possible in some towns to not even own the FB but be able to place a FRU at the town you are attacking. This is done by targeting the enemy FB and simply driving around it until you reach the max range from the FB and you can then place the FRU and attack town.

Should this be shortened?

That is it off the top of my head, I've not exactly gone around doing any bug hunting, these are just the glaringly obvious ones that jump out to me and just about anyone who has played the game a decent amount.

These are mostly feedback issues which we have about 30 tickets for covering a lot more of these. i think the issue is that the system got only slightly more complex but the feedback was really over the top. There is a whole set of informatin that truck drivers simply didn;t need becuse the mechani said only "you can now place on" or "You can;t place on" and truck drivers had gotten it down pat. Now that every player can sessentially use this functionality they are really confused with the brioken feedback. We're working on it.

Maybe we could leave this thread open so that people can add in other bugs they've noticed and we can have them all neat and ordered in one thread.

[GOPHUR]

So is someone going to fix the bug where you can spawn from a FRU no matter where you put it?

I mean, either fix the 2 second "magic" spawn time from ANY fru or post it in the start page of the game like you did with para INTO the FB tents.

That seemed to work and stop people for the most part. Make it a banable issue until it is fixed or EVERYONE is going to start looking into more.

Thanks for your time. I understand you are very busy at this point. Must be Christmas coming or something.

Fixed in beta, please test.

[HuskerGI]

Thanks Gophur!

Will do some testing tonight with it. I know a few of the squadmates will be available to test with me.

S!

[mattwitt]

If you make a mission to attack a town and then go to that town and set a FRU, it seems that once the town is contested and your FRU goes down you are unable to make a new one, you get some message that says "BadTarget?RangeToFar?"

This is partially fixed in beta. When your target goes down your mission target is no longer valid so you can;t place an MSP there. This was true with truck MSPs before as well.

To get around that first bug you do not make the target for the town, you make the target a CP/AB in town. Generally speaking the AB is used. However, this presents a problem in larger towns. As it seems if you make your target for one AB on one side of town, but then the attack progresses and you move your FRU to attack the other AB, the system only does a range check on the AB you made the target of your mission. So you are able to place your FRU pretty much right next to the other AB.

Can I get a specific example. I have been trying unsuccessfully to replicate this in beta. Here's my test case:

• create a mission attacking an enemy owned Antwerp

• target the southern ab

• parameters for FRU placement should be
  • within 3000m of your target (in this case the southern ab)

  • 400m away from any enemy facility (this includes the other abs at antewrp, all owned by the enemy)

  [*]What did I see

  • when I got 3km from the SAB I could place the FRU - correct

  • When I got on the AF tile I could not place the FRU - correct

  • When I was 400m away from target I could not place FRU - correct

  [*]Then I'll approach the CAB from the south

  • there are no facilities within 400m and I can place the FRU - correct

  • I can find no place within 400m of the CAB that I can place the FRU - Correct

I'm going to need a better report than any I've been given to track this bug down.

Also on the same issue, if in extremely large towns, such as antwerp it is possible to have a CP or AB targeted but be unable to make a FRU at certain parts of town because it is too far away from the target of your mission. IE you can not target the AF AB in Antwerp and then deploy a FRU at the NAB. This may or may not be WAD, but is quite the flaw considering if you could make the target Antwerp, without fear of your FRU becoming bugged. You would be able to place a FRU wherever in town.

no change sinece the truck MSP AFAIK. Missions haev never been properly used with origins and targets and that is something we'll change when we go group focused spawning with dynamic origins and targets.

Also there is no min distance range restrictions on placing a FRU at an FB.They can be and are quite often placed right next to the tents.

Fixed in beta, please test.

With the max range being 3k now which is nearly double what the max range with MSPs was, it is actually possible in some towns to not even own the FB but be able to place a FRU at the town you are attacking. This is done by targeting the enemy FB and simply driving around it until you reach the max range from the FB and you can then place the FRU and attack town.

Should this be shortened?

That is it off the top of my head, I've not exactly gone around doing any bug hunting, these are just the glaringly obvious ones that jump out to me and just about anyone who has played the game a decent amount.

These are mostly feedback issues which we have about 30 tickets for covering a lot more of these. i think the issue is that the system got only slightly more complex but the feedback was really over the top. There is a whole set of informatin that truck drivers simply didn;t need becuse the mechani said only "you can now place on" or "You can;t place on" and truck drivers had gotten it down pat. Now that every player can sessentially use this functionality they are really confused with the brioken feedback. We're working on it.

Maybe we could leave this thread open so that people can add in other bugs they've noticed and we can have them all neat and ordered in one thread.

I'll keep an eye open for the next time they super close FRU pops up.

I personally think the 3k range should be reduced. It does allow people to bypass FBs at some towns that are close but still have FBs (Breda-Ettenleur) Also I can make a defensive mission from a town and set FRUs at the FBs and bust every FB on that same mission.

[noons]

I personally think the 3k range should be reduced. It does allow people to bypass FBs at some towns that are close but still have FBs (Breda-Ettenleur) Also I can make a defensive mission from a town and set FRUs at the FBs and bust every FB on that same mission.

This was being done with msps so no different than before and probably one that most were aware of.

I think the FRU's have caught most on the hop and they are still learning the limitations of the beast. Hence the pushing of the envelope that some gamers strive to do.

[GOPHUR]

Us too noons. This was actually a compromise feature. Some wanted us to have "spawn at mission leader" like some show box games have. I'm not convinced on that. We wanted to have more player built structures for spawning and this is an easy way to test out if we;re going to let you build forward vehicle spawns or defensive positions that spawn AT guns.

We're all still testing the waters.

@mattwitt

Thanks. If I can replicate it I can get it fixed but I need some better methods because it isn't happening now in my testing.

[branko]

Wait and see during Live-Intermission, GOPHER.

I think the bug Matt describes is due to contested towns (and Area Attacks) ... that is when I have been able to do it anyway.

From your post and testing in response to the "Contested Towns" bug (you failed to replicate), maybe the issue has been resolved.

(I'll try to replicate on the live server a bit later)

[GOPHUR]

Could be fixed. We did change a lot of the core stuff there. Please keep me updated if you see it and I'll try and nail it down.