Not a New Allied persona! UI & CSR FEEDBACK

[kamel]

It's a B.A.R.,

It will not be called a "Light Machine Gun" in the UI but as far as weapons classes go in the CURRENT game, it will function as one, and that includes scoring, for the time being.

When we have more weapons and can create properly functional new classes outside the current paradigm, that will be when we do that.

We're simply employing a means to an end and we're not at that end yet.

The whole 'Light Machine gun' pigeon hole is flawed... and its interesting to note that modern militaries don't use the term in the same context.

BAR, Fm24/29, and Bren would all be considered SAW's or IAW's. The MG34 would be a GPMG. Their use, limitations, and operation would, and do, differ consideranbly.

Pigeon holing them all and making them all work the same is just silly.

Sure, in WWII they were all squad automatic weapons... but you didn't see them used the same. They might not have been called different terms, but they used them in the way that modern militaries use them today.

A GPMG makes a poor SAW, and a SAW makes a poor GPMG.

Operation, and use of BAR, BREN and Fm24/29 may as well be identical other than minor layout differences. All can be shouldered while standing. All work reasonably well from the hip.

The MG34 is much superior while set up on the bipod, but is much less handy while moving. I seriously doubt you could shoulder it while standing... no foregrip. It certainly wouldn't be as simple as the others.

I certainly don't understand why the BAR is being treated differently to the BREN and FM24/29.

The FM24/29 basically IS a BAR with minor cosmetic differences.

There is nothing you can do with a BAR that you can't do with a BREN or FM24/29. Technically both BREN and FM24/29 are better at everything... which isn't surprising given they were much more modern designs.

[brogan123]

The whole 'Light Machine gun' pigeon hole is flawed... and its interesting to note that modern militaries don't use the term in the same context.

In WWII the squad's automatic supressing weapons were called light machine guns. Just because in modern militaries called squad automatic weapons or light support weapons or whatever now doesn't mean our light machine guns weren't used in that way.

Because all four of the LMGs in this game were issued to squads as their suppressing weapon.

BAR' date=' Fm24/29, and Bren would all be considered SAW's or IAW's. The MG34 would be a GPMG. Their use, limitations, and operation would, and do, differ consideranbly.[/quote']

The bipod drum-fed MG34 would be considered a SAW, along with the other LMGs in this game. They all fired rifle cartridges.

Just because the MG 34 can be fed by a 250 round belt and stuck on a tripod doesn't mean it can't also be a light machine gun.

Sure' date=' in WWII they were all squad automatic weapons... but you didn't see them used the same. They might not have been [b']called different terms, but they used them in the way that modern militaries use them today.

A GPMG makes a poor SAW, and a SAW makes a poor GPMG.

The light MG 34 was used in exactly the same way as the Bren, BAR and FM 24, as the base of suppressive fire for the squad. It performed the role just as well.

You're too influenced by modern military history. Modern SAWs fire assault rifle cartridges, while GPMGs fire rifle cartridges. The MG 34 wasn't a modern GPMG like the FN MAG. It could be either an FN Minimi or and FN MAG depending on how it was a configured. A more understandable term term today would be a universal machine gun, one that can be configured to be either a squad's automatic weapon or a higher unit's fire support.

Operation' date=' and use of BAR, BREN and Fm24/29 may as well be identical other than minor layout differences. All can be shouldered while standing. All work reasonably well from the hip.[/quote']

There's no way you could shoulder fire anything but the BAR. The Bren gun was only 750 g lighter than the Mg 34. The BAR was 3.75 kg lighter than the Bren, and a lot smaller and straighter. The Bren was huge, and ergonomically unsuited to being shoulder fired, even if it was light enough.

The Bren and FM 24 are both far more akin to the light configured MG 34 than the BAR. They're just as big, and can sustain fire far better than the BAR.

I certainly don't understand why the BAR is being treated differently to the BREN and FM24/29.

The FM24/29 basically IS a BAR with minor cosmetic differences.

There is nothing you can do with a BAR that you can't do with a BREN or FM24/29. Technically both BREN and FM24/29 are better at everything... which isn't surprising given they were much more modern designs.

You can't shoulder fire a Bren. It weighs a ton more than a BAR and is much bigger. It's a far better light machine than the BAR because it shoots faster and can sustain fire better due to its far quicker reload time and larger magazine.

The Bren and FM 24 are far more akin to the light MG 34 and a lot bigger than the BAR. The BAR is more appropriate in the IAR role in the USMC squad. It's more like a hybrid of a rifle and machine gun.

when they are able to add additional weapons classes is when they will start differentiating weapons like the B.A.R. from true LMG's.

Even though the BAR was the first true IAR, it will alays be an LMG in this game, because that's the role the US army pressed it into even though it didn't quite fit the description.

Edited August 6, 2011 by brogan123

[fxmmauser]

There's no way you could shoulder fire anything but the BAR. The Bren gun was only 750 g lighter than the Mg 34. The BAR was 3.75 kg lighter than the Bren, and a lot smaller and straighter. The Bren was huge, and ergonomically unsuited to being shoulder fired, even if it was light enough.

The MG34 is much superior while set up on the bipod, but is much less handy while moving. I seriously doubt you could shoulder it while standing... no foregrip. It certainly wouldn't be as simple as the others.

Well I'm sorry but YOU CAN FIRE THE MG 34 WHILE STANDING LIKE A RIFLE and heres the vid.

This guy is from texas has alot of videos with alot of original ww2 weapons from lmgs to rifles.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh-BlCTK3lo

Edited August 6, 2011 by fxmmauser

[hick]

In WWII the squad's automatic supressing weapons were called light machine guns. Just because in modern militaries called squad automatic weapons or light support weapons or whatever now doesn't mean our light machine guns weren't used in that way.

Because all four of the LMGs in this game were issued to squads as their suppressing weapon.

The bipod drum-fed MG34 would be considered a SAW, along with the other LMGs in this game. They all fired rifle cartridges.

Just because the MG 34 can be fed by a 250 round belt and stuck on a tripod doesn't mean it can't also be a light machine gun.

The light MG 34 was used in exactly the same way as the Bren, BAR and FM 24, as the base of suppressive fire for the squad. It performed the role just as well.

You're too influenced by modern military history. Modern SAWs fire assault rifle cartridges, while GPMGs fire rifle cartridges. The MG 34 wasn't a modern GPMG like the FN MAG. It could be either an FN Minimi or and FN MAG depending on how it was a configured. A more understandable term term today would be a universal machine gun, one that can be configured to be either a squad's automatic weapon or a higher unit's fire support.

There's no way you could shoulder fire anything but the BAR. The Bren gun was only 750 g lighter than the Mg 34. The BAR was 3.75 kg lighter than the Bren, and a lot smaller and straighter. The Bren was huge, and ergonomically unsuited to being shoulder fired, even if it was light enough.

The Bren and FM 24 are both far more akin to the light configured MG 34 than the BAR. They're just as big, and can sustain fire far better than the BAR.

You can't shoulder fire a Bren. It weighs a ton more than a BAR and is much bigger. It's a far better light machine than the BAR because it shoots faster and can sustain fire better due to its far quicker reload time and larger magazine.

The Bren and FM 24 are far more akin to the light MG 34 and a lot bigger than the BAR. The BAR is more appropriate in the IAR role in the USMC squad. It's more like a hybrid of a rifle and machine gun.

Even though the BAR was the first true IAR, it will alays be an LMG in this game, because that's the role the US army pressed it into even though it didn't quite fit the description.

I was simply explaining what Doc had said that you apparently didn't understand. No point in trying to argue the points of it with me, as it doesn't make a bit of difference to me what you call it

[DOC]

this is the TESTING and BUG REPORTING forum don't forget