US sniper

[Khsolo]

I saw a fix for this today. 1.34.2. probably.

Great ! eta for 1.34.2?

[jackybunne]

Good info. Didn't know that.

I...found that out in the tutorial o..o I thought it was common knowlage D:

[jackybunne]

Working on it boys. At present that's as thin as the scope tech we're using will get. Agree it is not good enough.

Thanks for your support on this Will be awaiting whenever it's altered

[xspiers]

Yes Rats *need* to get this fixed or gonna be alot of upset players. I must have aimed and fired at 6 EI yesterday and they all missed. Some people are welcome to take the #### and say: ''learn to aim,'' but the lines in the scope cover the ei from 400m away and because of this it is very inacurate.

[xspiers]

Yes Rats *need* to get this fixed or gonna be alot of upset players. I must have aimed and fired at 6 EI yesterday and they all missed. Some people are welcome to take the #### and say: ''learn to aim' date=''' but the lines in the scope cover the ei from 400m away and because of this it is very inacurate.[/quote'] Sorry rats i love 1.34 but if you could tweak the scope it would be apreciated by alot of players, including myself.

yours,

spiersey

[jackybunne]

Yes Rats *need* to get this fixed or gonna be alot of upset players. I must have aimed and fired at 6 EI yesterday and they all missed. Some people are welcome to take the #### and say: ''learn to aim' date=''' but the lines in the scope cover the ei from 400m away and because of this it is very inacurate.[/quote']

I managed a 28 kill sortie with the US sniper but that was when I had a good cover position 400m outside their spawn building, but it was difficult, i had to go back to the FRU 4 times to re-load my ammo because the scope crosshairs covered the windows completely, made it impossible to see when ei was in sight when waiting for them to peek their lil heads out, would have to sit the crosshairs to the side of the window to watch it then move it back over and hope i could hit the bit of shoulder i could see.

[rafaelbr]

Well, Historically the us crosshair is like that. constant width, a little thicker, yes.

The diffrence in "quality" of the Germans scopes to Allied ones at the time is explained by diffrent sniping douctrines. The Aliies used the sniper just as a infantry suport hole, usualy having a sniper per group or so.

For the Heer, in the other hand, the sniper was a hunter, staying alone and not atached to a group.

If you dont want to study much of the history, you notice that in films like Private Ryan and Enemy at the Gates.

The german philosophy was "have a high skilled lonely scharfschutzer" while the americans would have "a high skilled counter-adversities suport into the group".

the russians were the founders of the modern sniping doctrine, with a shooter and a spotter witch dubs as SMG cover for the times of SNAFU.

well, what i want to say is: yes, the american sniper rifle is worse (specialy concerning to optics) than the german because it's role was diffrent.

As endline, I had the chance of having both rifles with its optics at hand, and they are like in the game. The german optics are light-years ahead of the allies counterpart.

[mile]

Well, Historically the us crosshair is like that. constant width, a little thicker, yes.

The diffrence in "quality" of the Germans scopes to Allied ones at the time is explained by diffrent sniping douctrines. The Aliies used the sniper just as a infantry suport hole, usualy having a sniper per group or so.

For the Heer, in the other hand, the sniper was a hunter, staying alone and not atached to a group.

If you dont want to study much of the history, you notice that in films like Private Ryan and Enemy at the Gates.

The german philosophy was "have a high skilled lonely scharfschutzer" while the americans would have "a high skilled counter-adversities suport into the group".

the russians were the founders of the modern sniping doctrine, with a shooter and a spotter witch dubs as SMG cover for the times of SNAFU.

well, what i want to say is: yes, the american sniper rifle is worse (specialy concerning to optics) than the german because it's role was diffrent.

As endline, I had the chance of having both rifles with its optics at hand, and they are like in the game. The german optics are light-years ahead of the allies counterpart.

didn't the germans use primitive starlight scopes, or am i thinking of something totally different. im sure i read that somewhere.

[rafaelbr]

yes and no.

starlight scopes, yes, but not "simply".

"lunetes" can be well used, projected and modifyed acording to purposes of the builder, and the german ones had a better crosshair than the americans. in fact not a crosshair, but the needle, as we know, exactly with the purpose of NOT OCLUDING a small target.

in the other hand, the german scope have a downside. you cant see a target when he is running sideways across the sight, making it a bit dificult to "track ahead" a farther traget. The horizontal bar is too thick even for some nearer targets.

[Hardlead]

Take a look at Wiki;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sniper

For aiming optics German snipers used the Zeiss Zielvier 4x (ZF39) telescopic sight which had bullet drop compensation in 50 m increments for ranges from 100 m up to 800 m or in some variations from 100 m up to 1000 m or 1200 m. There were ZF42, Zielfernrohr 43 (ZF 4), Zeiss Zielsechs 6x and other telescopic sights by various manufacturers like the Ajack 4x, Hensoldt Dialytan 4x and Kahles Heliavier 4x with similar features employed on German sniper rifles.

Those optics were absolutly state of the art in the 30s/40s.

US Army's lack of familiarity with sniping tactics resulted in disastrous effects in Normandy and the campaign in Western Europe where they encountered well trained German snipers.[

I think or Rats have been very generous, at least there ARE Allied snipers in the game.

[rafaelbr]

the rats are being generous not to give a panzerfaust to every rifleman

[ratatosk]

I would still prefer to have a pistol as a side arm, the LMG has one, so does a few other classes, like the SMG, which shouldn't even need it.

And often I am snipering from a long distance, but in town defence where it's good to be in a tall building sometimes, it would just be better to have a sidearm for backup. Modern snipers always have a pistol, and I know I would want a backup weapon...Just would make more sense to me to have a pistol.

Just FYI, the airborne snipers do have pistols and they obviously come in handy. Before my time, but I think that normal snipers also had them originally, but they were removed as too uber.

[delems]

Hmm, not being an expert at all on snipers, but reading through the posts, it sounds like the sniper rifle is ok. Yes, it sounds like it is not as good as other sniper rifles, but it wasn't irl either; so it's modeled correctly it seems.

If the US didn't use their snipers for 600+m solo shots, then our game should mimmic that, it sounds like it does.

[rafaelbr]

the US mindset at those times was "designated marksman" which reflects on the weapon & gear of choice.

about the side arm, yes, they used it, but usualy carring only one "extra" magazine, if that much. after all, sneking around with much gear isnt smart. and gear makes noise

[GOPHUR]

Didn't make 1.34.2 since no data was patched. Should go out in the next release. Sorry I don't have time to comment on the whole thread today. Anyone want to give me the summary. Lot of noise to signal in here.

[rafaelbr]

To resume, Gophs, the allies are complaining that their crosshair is too thick.

on the other side, specialy me, there is a defense that the scope is historicaly acurate and adequate to the historical role of "designated marksman" that the sniper character is supose to interpret.

on the side arm discussion, most agree tha a pistol would be adequate.

to support my thesis, i would say that i had hand on both rifles and their scopes, and the thing is pretty acccurate the way it is. perhaps you may add a "blured edge" on the american x-hair.

[romzburg]

Didn't make 1.34.2 since no data was patched. Should go out in the next release. Sorry I don't have time to comment on the whole thread today. Anyone want to give me the summary. Lot of noise to signal in here.

Crosshairs too fat, make it hard to see the guy you are shooting at when using the rifle at a range that is appropriate for "sniper".

Even if 100% perfect model, they are too fat for us to play the game.

Skinny crosshairs, even if ahistorical, are better for the game and their ahistoricality is not a big enough deal to warrant keeping them fat.

____________________

motormouth:

Much as Romzy's posting style can give me headaches (and the fact that he's "NEVAR WRONG!!"), that post pretty much nails it on the head.

sgtchief:

romz you['re] my damn hero

sydney:

Ya know, at first Romsburg, you rubbed me the wrong way and I wasn't a fan. But over the past 12 months, you have really grown on me. You're precise, well spoken and although you are sometimes a little harsh, you are most often correct and in proper context with your responses.

irelandeb:

indeed he's one of the few voices of common sense on these forums

jw:

If you're going to argue with Romz, do your homework before you post. He gets it, and you can't teach common sense, you have to be born with it.

pete, linc & julie:

I can't say [any]thing else [than] that the ban was justified considering that you have an 'impressive' TOS history....

owilde:

The only thing worse than being talked about is *not* being talked about.

[DOC]

Please refrain from comment until you have seen the updated version, as per what Gophur just told you was coming

(which is also the definition of high signal/low noise which he also mentioned)

[GOPHUR]

TY Romz.

[delems]

Am I missing something? or not understanding something?

So you say that the American sniper should be modeled incorrectly so that you can use it in a way that was not historical, nor even based on reality?

If so, then why not up armor Panzers so we can use them more like Allied tanks? I hope I'm missing something here or confused.

[rafaelbr]

good point.

[GOPHUR]

Am I missing something? or not understanding something?

So you say that the American sniper should be modeled incorrectly so that you can use it in a way that was not historical, nor even based on reality?

If so, then why not up armor Panzers so we can use them more like Allied tanks? I hope I'm missing something here or confused.

We make some concessions to gameplay, like changing the rear sights on rifles to be usable. There are concessions to accuracy that have to be made in a simulation to make the game function. Armor thinckness isn't one of them but concussive resistance or gun barrel threshold is.

It's a fine line.

Edited November 16, 2011 by GOPHUR

[mile]

It's a fine line.

no it isn't

(couldn't resist, sorry)

[sssnake]

I managed a 28 kill sortie with the US sniper but that was when I had a good cover position 400m outside their spawn building' date=' but it was difficult, i had to go back to the FRU 4 times to re-load my ammo because the scope crosshairs covered the windows completely, made it impossible to see when ei was in sight when waiting for them to peek their lil heads out, would have to sit the crosshairs to the side of the window to watch it then move it back over and hope i could hit the bit of shoulder i could see.[/quote']

i have to do the same-aim off to the side, then change aim point, which gives the EI a lot of time to spot and kill me.

Easy suggestion-Change to the same sniper view as the german or brit. While historically incorrect, it will work for the game, and that's good enough for me. (and prob everyone else except the dead EI's-ROTFLMAO)

[delems]

I have no problem with changing something to ensure it works like it works in reality. If one has to change the sights a bit, so it gives a better representation of reality, then fine.

But, to change something cause it doesn't work as good, and it really didn't work as good; just so it works as good as the other side (or simply so it works better) is not correct imo.

If the US sniper regularly and normally could snipe from 400+ m and the cross hair didn't interfere, then I would agree it maybe needs to be changed a bit. But, if the rifle didn't do that, then ours shouldn't either.