The 109 flop

[rote7]

was it recently refixed? My F4 flops all over the place, even in maneuvers that werent a problem in 1.33. No rudders were touched.

Come on, I can't even change directions in an abrupt manner now - isn't that direction change thingy kind of a requirement for successfull air combat?

[omar67]

to go with that, seems that blackout onset is a lot faster now. I'm pulling turns in the E1 that never gave me problems before but now I'm fighting blackout all the time. Same for F2.

[VodkaAce]

the flop is a feature. get use to it

[Ogg]

As I said in a previous thread, the flop is back, but not as prevalent as in 1.32. it was fixed for 1.33 then the 1.34 came out and it is back somewhat. look for it.

[rebel357]

u guys r paranoid, no plane files been touched in a long time.

[VodkaAce]

u guys r paranoid' date=' no plane files been touched in a long time.[/quote']

you mean they didn't mean to touch any plane files but inadvertently did.

Just like how they didn't mean for us to have to dl a whole game file for the new patch and have the playgate server have an epic fail and 9/10 people have CTD issues.

[SNIPER62]

u guys r paranoid' date=' no plane files been touched in a long time.[/quote']

DOC is that you?

[li85]

Everyone Has Noticed A change in the 09, it Flops, Not stable, Something Deff wrong with it, either its been Nerfed to **** , It really has some issues. When the fock wulf comes in in a couple days Im expecting it to be **** too. With Spits Appearing to Get Hit Hard smoking out turn you or catch you, or u see an 87 at 4k co alt and climb 2 k above you Come on CRS get your **** rite

[SNIPER62]

you mean they didn't mean to touch any plane files but inadvertently did.

lol at that one...

Opps!

[narg]

I'd whine about 109 flops, but it flops for me, regardless of the patch.

Bad pilot...

[beazil]

I haven't noticed a flop increase or decrease. Do I notice E-defying maneuvers by allied planes? Instantaneous zoom climbs and unparalleled maneuverability? Inability to catch diving EA? Baffling levels of situational awareness? Sure I do. If I try to duplicate what they do I black out, lose E and flop, or just plain old wind up dead.

So I try not to do those things. I either get the drop on a guy, or I don't. IF I'm feeling particularly stupid I'll tangle with a higher EA, or engage in a turn fight/loopfest and usually die as a result. I may think it unreasonable that my opponent can do things that I can't, but I'm sure they feel the same way about our climb out ability (until the dreaded IX comes in).

I also know that I can't pull alot of what I see my opponents doing when I fly a hawk or spit, so clearly I'm "doing it wrong". Contrary to my frequent rants of frustration on TS I know some of these people can throw their birds around in ways that I do not yet know how to either a) duplicate or counter.

When I have it all figured out, I'll let you know. Until then I have much to learn.

Edit: Rebel is right in his statement. Not that you guys are wrong - but he is right in that there has been no documentation of fm changes for the 109's recently. Probably because none were (deliberately) made.

Edited January 4, 2012 by beazil

[VodkaAce]

I haven't noticed a flop increase or decrease. Do I notice E-defying maneuvers by allied planes? Instantaneous zoom climbs and unparalleled maneuverability? Inability to catch diving EA? Baffling levels of situational awareness? Sure I do. If I try to duplicate what they do I black out, lose E and flop, or just plain old wind up dead.

So I try not to do those things. I either get the drop on a guy, or I don't. IF I'm feeling particularly stupid I'll tangle with a higher EA, or engage in a turn fight/loopfest and usually die as a result. I may think it unreasonable that my opponent can do things that I can't, but I'm sure they feel the same way about our climb out ability (until the dreaded IX comes in).

I also know that I can't pull alot of what I see my opponents doing when I fly a hawk or spit, so clearly I'm "doing it wrong". Contrary to my frequent rants of frustration on TS I know some of these people can throw their birds around in ways that I do not yet know how to either a) duplicate or counter.

When I have it all figured out, I'll let you know. Until then I have much to learn.

Edit: Rebel is right in his statement. Not that you guys are wrong - but he is right in that there has been no documentation of fm changes for the 109's recently. Probably because none were (deliberately) made.

agreed there. In no other flight sim have I ever seen planes be able to do the manuavers they can do in this game.(some fighters and bombers.) Some spits take the cake.

Not sure if it's some players being able to play the model 100% due to them having a certain stick, rudder pedal setup what have you or maybe it's just a unintended flight model. But either way this flight sim defies historical realism to a degree. Not that it's really anything new.

[DOC]

No aircraft files have been checked out for editing at all, in any manner since the last changes made back in v1.33 release schedule. Not a single one.

If you are experiencing a change, please provide as much comparitive analysis and replication detail to help illustrate what this is, so that we can examine it to determine perhaps where the cause might be.

Even inadvertant changes in the past required that files be changed. They can't change anything if they are unchanged from previous.

[omar67]

Even inadvertant changes in the past required that files be changed. They can't change anything if they are unchanged from previous.

but what about........(clamps hand over mouth)

[rebel357]

Then you woke up.

[focke66]

The flop is rough. Now that Ihave a twisty JS (for now) I cant even control the damn thing. I've maped out rudder sensitivity, gave myself a large deadband, and still Im a menace to myself and the spawn list. It requires studying on the scale of mastering Kyudo.

OK maybe not that much but in gaming terms, yeah.

[DOC]

well Focke, before the changes that decreased the "flop" effect, a twisty joystick was an even worse decision to use

I suggest if you could manage before this time with a twisty stick, that since the change, it seems worse only because you lost your edge, because these planes flop much less now than they used to