Flak 30 damage model.

[delems]

There seems to be something definitely out of whack with the flak 30 damage model.

When I'm in a 232, and my crew 1 dies; my crew member 2 and 3 work just fine. I can look around and fire my gun. Just crew 1 is not functional.

However, when my crew 1 dies in a flak 30, the crew 2 ceases to function too!? There is no damage to crew 2, yet he is useless. How come crew 2 can't still look around and fire when there is no damage?

[DOC]

All manned guns work the same way, with respect to crew. AAG's and ATG's have 2 crew, a commander and a gunner. When you lose your gunner, you can't fire the weapon anymore. They all function this way, not just the FlaK.30 .... if you lost your gunner in the SdKfz.232 you wouldn't be able to shoot that gun either. Same for all armoured vehicles.

[PITTPETE]

He isnt talking about that.If you're deployed in an ATG/AAA gun if the gunner #2 has no damage and commander #1 is dead you can usually still turn the gun and shoot.You cant undeploy and move obviously.

[DOC]

It took several rereads to get his point, the comparison to the 232 solved it however. I am sure he's talking about losing the commander BEFORE he has deployed and made ready to shoot. That would mean he can't shoot because he cant deploy the gun, and that is a requirement to be able to shoot it. In a vehicle (232 example) you don't have to deploy it to be able to shoot.

That's how it's designed. It might annoy a person but it's not a bug. Knowing exactly how all this was made within the games parameters I wouldn't be expecting a redesign of this to be anything likely to occur.

Just a little information, and a best guess. It doesn't matter if it is ignored for that purpose. I just like people to understand stuff, and that's the only reason I post about it.

Edited July 26, 2015 by DOC

[delems]

To clarify, I was deployed and shooting. My number 1 got killed, there was no damage to #2 at all. But, I was unable to rotate my gun or shoot or do anything. I would have expected my #2 to continue to be alive until he died - but that was not the case. I understand I would no longer be able to undeploy and move - as my cmdr is dead.

In the 232, when my #1 dies, my #2 and 3 are still functional, this is not the same behavior I saw with the flak 30.

[PITTPETE]

Sometimes the actual gun takes damage and you cant move or shoot even though gunner is uninjured..

This used to happen constantly with the pak36 back in the day..Couple of rifle plinks and gun became useless.

[delems]

So more than just the tiger has a glass gun? Didn't know that. It still seems my #2 should be functional, even if gun is disabled/malfunctioned. I should be able to look around, move gun etc., juts not fire. But, that could possibly explain it, there is no notification the gun is not working? (like it says crew member one hit)

Btw, I was just in a flak 30 again. This time I was deployed and shooting and my #2 got killed. BUT, I could easily still use my #1 to undeploy and move around - that crew member was still fully functional.

Edited July 27, 2015 by delems

[DOC]

Was your gunner wounded at all ? Did you make a note of that possibility, to discount it ?

[delems]

The indicators for life, the health bars both showed full. So I saw no reason to believe the crew member was injured. I didn't consider you allowing wounds to the crew and not showing that.

If that is true, then how does one ever know if anything is injured / damaged if the game doesn't display it?

Does this mean my rifleman can be injured and me not know it because the health bars are full?

I actually find it discouraging that my person/equipment might be taking damage and me not knowing it. I'd think if it is important enough to track the injury/damage - then it is important enough to display that to me.

[DOC]

If crew are wounded the health bars will reflect that. At some point they will cease to function before they actually go skulls (dead).

[narg]

Can they be degunned?

[DOC]

I haven't looked at those data files in forever .... but I would hazard a guess that the answer is yes. I think, although the values will vary a lot, that all AFV, ATG and AA (and even naval in all probability) guns can be disabled.

I can't however be certain or verify this of course. You'd have to ask Xoom.

[narg]

I haven't looked at those data files in forever .... but I would hazard a guess that the answer is yes. I think, although the values will vary a lot, that all AFV, ATG and AA (and even naval in all probability) guns can be disabled.

I can't however be certain or verify this of course. You'd have to ask Xoom.

I just know i've experienced the same issue here, with both the 25mm and the flak 30.

I always figured it was a fluke degun.