Supply list seems borked.

[Augetout]

7 minutes ago, z17 said:

Count another sub gone, not fighting 34 vrs 56.

 

The numbers you are looking at, are inaccurate.  If you do not wish to believe OHM, who DOES the garrison numbers, and if you do not wish to believe me, who just wasted 1/2 hour spawning in-game to try and figure out where the problem is, then spawn into a backline town yourself, create a mission at the AB, and take a look for yourself.  You will see that 34 is NOT the number.

[tater]

9 minutes ago, z17 said:

Count another sub gone, not fighting 34 vrs 56.

You're not a sub anyway, or do you mean you won't be subbing in the future (you could continue to consider subbing until you have real data (read below)).

 

4 minutes ago, Augetout said:

In the interest of full disclosure, I am not a math major.  Having said that, I just spawned in-game, as a german, then French, then Brit, and in each case went to a backline town, and joined the army garrison.

The numbers I saw are as follows:

Germans 33 smgs, plus 12 Italian SMGs, plus 12 Reserve SMGs, plus 12 NCO (who carry SMGs), plus 6 mp34, plus 6 reserve mp34, plus 6 reserve mp40.  All totaled:  87.   Take out ALL DLC and NCO, and the total is:  55 (or 61, as I plum forget if the MP34s should count).

For the French:  38 SMGs plus 8 reserve plus 8 NCO, totaling:  54.  Take out the reserve and NCO and the total is then 38.

For the Brits:  41 SMGs, plus 15 Stens, plus 8 NCO plus 4 reserve for a total of 67.  Take out the reserve and NCO and the total is 55.

So, the worst-case I see is germans with 55, French with 38, and the Brits with 55.

I did this to check and see if there is a difference between what is coded (what I asked OHM for earlier) and what is making it in-game.  There is no difference that I can see, and there have been no changes to the SMGs spawn list for the past 3 campaigns.  Nothing is broken, and I'm just not seeing hwo you are getting the numbers you are getting.  I've looked at the code, and I've looked at clean garrisons in-game.  Neither show what you are seeing.

 

Thanks for doing this.

2 minutes ago, delems said:

Finally, someone can count and read.

Good job tat.   YOU finally have shown some sense in here.

 

You need to look at fair comparisons aug;  1 AB town vrs 1 AB town.

PS  I was also just in game, and tat is 100% correct.

 

I guess the charts site is not reflecting the actual numbers.

I simply followed the link given in the other thread. Checking in game is obviously the best answer to the question, which @Augetout just did for us.

 

 

Edited July 11, 2019 by tater

[Augetout]

2 minutes ago, delems said:

Finally, someone can count and read.

Good job tat.   YOU finally have shown some sense in here.

 

You need to look at fair comparisons aug;  1 AB town vrs 1 AB town.

PS  I was also just in game, and tat is 100% correct.

 

The website being cited by Tater, (and he did not vouch for it's accuracy, which is good because it is not accurate), and by (I guess) you, Delems, IS NOT ACCURATE.  I'll say it again:  The CODE says differently, and I JUST verified the code by spawning in-game and comparing the numbers.  They are in agreement:  The germans are NOT being screwed over in SMG numbers.  Don't believe the game manager (OHM) or me who just wasted 1/2 hour on a wild goose chase----spawn in yourself into a backline town (1 ab to 1 ab), and look for yourself.  The garrison code/numbers haven't been changed in the past 3 campaigns.

[Randazzo]

This is a single-AB axis town:

[delems]

Yes, and the single AB town says 22 + 8 + 4.

Can you count now ????? 

 

[z17]

= You're not a sub anyway

True, not anymore.

 

[Randazzo]

Just now, delems said:

Yes, and the single AB town says 22 + 8 + 4.

Can you count now ????? 

 

I understand that you are frustrated, and reasonably so. I am not arguing against you here.

 

[OHM]

the numbers were fine when the axis won the 1st campaign with 6 tiers  ,,, now they are losing the numbers are now wrong ???  .... the NUMBERS HAVE NOT CHANGED FOR THE PAST 3 CAMPAIGNS !!!  

[delems]

***  I'll say it again:  The CODE says differently, and I JUST verified the code by spawning in-game and comparing the numbers.

As have I, and you are incorrect.

 

Do you really think I'd spend days brining up an issue that isn't true?

That I would do bug reports, make forum posts?
 

That I wouldn't 100% check the numbers?  (which I have done numerous times)

There is an obvious spawn list error here, and if it is not an error, please explain the discrepancy then.

 

[delems]

*** now they are losing the numbers are now wrong ???

No, if what you say is true, then they were wrong when axis was winning.

And they are still wrong now that axis is losing.

 

Edited July 11, 2019 by delems

[Augetout]

Meh.

It turns out I was looking at 1 ab town to 1 ab town, but despite joining the army garrison naval numbers were thrown into the mix.  My humble apologies.

None of that means the numbers are wrong in-game, and I understand the determined search for a reason for losing this campaign other than simply being beaten.  I do not pretend to understand the complexities involved in how the spawn lists are derived, but I am sure there is a logic behind it.  In the end, the spawn lists have not changed in the last 3 campaigns, and again, I apologize for my faulty research.

[Augetout]

For the record, in 1 ab (no naval garrisons), the numbers are the following:

French:  24 Mas38 SMGs  24 total SMG

British:  41 Thompsons, 15 Stens  56 total SMG

Germans: 22 MP 40, 8 Italian SMGs, 4 MP 34  34 total SMG

Outnumbered by the Brits, but outnumbering the French.

Edited July 11, 2019 by Augetout

[delems]

*** Outnumbered by the Brits, but outnumbering the French.

Count better, french have 38 SMGs, germans  34.

 

*** I understand the determined search for a reason for losing this campaign

axis will lose this map regardless.

I have never, not once, made any reference to axis losing this map, not a single time.  Those are your words and thoughts.

I would just like a fair fight supply wise.

 

Edited July 11, 2019 by delems

[matamor]

Delems, I found out where are your SMGs... in my stats!!!11

Kills
Jul 10 21:27 wingman24 (DE MP34 SMG) JJul 10 21:30 brachmw (IT SMG) Jul 10 21:32 papo (DE SMG) Jul 10 21:32 wingman24 (DE MP34 SMG) Jul 10 21:34 wingman24 (DE MP34 SMG) Jul 10 21:35 forsenswa (DE Ltd MP34 SMG) Jul 10 21:38 forsenswa (DE Ltd MP34 SMG)

[delems]

Heh, I show you 3 - 2.

Means my 0.66 KD vrs you is better than our SMG numbers......  0.61.

Winning!

 

Edited July 11, 2019 by delems

[tater]

I wish all the sides were closer to 1 SMG and 1 LMG for every 10 rifles. More LMGs than SMGs, actually. Least until whatever tier is 1943.

The UK SMG numbers seem high to me. The French SMG numbers? Doesn't matter to me, I don't use them, they are too awful (we really do need a way to THROW the MAS 38 at people, it might be more useful).

[matamor]

I frankly hate the UK SMG, worst invention since the 2-holes button.

 

[tater]

15 minutes ago, matamor said:

I frankly hate the UK SMG, worst invention since the 2-holes button.

The Sten? Yeah, I don't like any of the SMGs enough to use them (in RL of the Thompson, Sten, and MP40 the Sten is my fave to shoot, however, followed by the tommy gun)

[Augetout]

2 hours ago, delems said:

*** Outnumbered by the Brits, but outnumbering the French.

Count better, french have 38 SMGs, germans  34.

 

*** I understand the determined search for a reason for losing this campaign

axis will lose this map regardless.

I have never, not once, made any reference to axis losing this map, not a single time.  Those are your words and thoughts.

I would just like a fair fight supply wise.

 

Drop the attitude when someone is apologizing, Delems.  Patience running thin now.   For the record, I spawned into 2 separate French 1 ab no navy towns, and got the same result (24)-----Having said that, I just tried a 3rd and it is 38.  What are the odds that the first 2 French towns I spawned into would both be partially depleted in SMGs only?  I dunno.  So once again I apologize.  Now I am done bothering with this.  Take it up with the game managers.  I did my bit for God and country, and to help figure it all out, and your attitude stinks, giving me the impression I was wasting my time in trying to help.  

[delems]

Just sad it takes days to realize there is an error.

And at a big cost to the game, allies don't care much, I get it;  but it has destroyed axis side, even more sad, which ultimately impacts game as a whole.

I've tried to care, tried to make things better, got pretty much nothing but flak and ignored.

Guess it is what it is.  Btw, see all of 3 axis players online atm.

 

There is a great saying in AA:

First you lose the heart, then the mind, finally the body; then your gone.

I don't even play much anymore now, and that is troubling, if you get the point.

May the battle continue

 

Edited July 11, 2019 by delems

[Randazzo]

6 hours ago, delems said:

Just sad it takes days to realize there is an error.

And at a big cost to the game, allies don't care much, I get it;  but it has destroyed axis side, even more sad, which ultimately impacts game as a whole.

I've tried to care, tried to make things better, got pretty much nothing but flak and ignored.

Guess it is what it is.  Btw, see all of 3 axis players online atm.

 

There is a great saying in AA:

First you lose the heart, then the mind, finally the body; then your gone.

I don't even play much anymore now, and that is troubling, if you get the point.

May the battle continue

 

It's a touch dramatic to say this destroyed the axis don't you think? Axis numbers are way down because a lot of people switched to play allied (if you recall, the allies were "destroyed" only a month or two ago) and others who liked to preen and brag about how amazingly skilled and awesome their side was stopped playing when numbers dropped, making it even worse. Same old dog and pony show it has ever been. Axis numbers will go back up and everything will be fine again and there will be plenty of "we're awesome!" and "they suck!" and it will be the allies turn to suffer for awhile. Then the cycle will repeat. What we're seeing is a symptom of game-wide population woes that is being treated as side specific population woes as it wobbles back and forth. 

I'm not saying you're wrong about the number disparity, just that you're blaming the wrong thing for something that isn't happening to the axis playerbase - it's happening to the playerbase as a whole. 

 

Edited July 11, 2019 by Randazzo

[bus0]

Dandare and co. gave us one hell of a fight yesterday in Stadtkyll, no SD either, at least some Axis are fighting with the present equipment.

If you think 20 more smg's is going to change anything, well, have fun in your delusions.

OHM will correct any mistakes, no need to repeatedly cry foul or bias this and that in the forums.

[ch0ad]

10 hours ago, Augetout said:

In the interest of full disclosure, I am not a math major.  Having said that, I just spawned in-game, as a german, then French, then Brit, and in each case went to a backline town, and joined the army garrison.

The numbers I saw are as follows:

Germans 33 smgs, plus 12 Italian SMGs, plus 12 Reserve SMGs, plus 12 NCO (who carry SMGs), plus 6 mp34, plus 6 reserve mp34, plus 6 reserve mp40.  All totaled:  87.   Take out ALL DLC and NCO, and the total is:  55 (or 61, as I plum forget if the MP34s should count).

For the French:  38 SMGs plus 8 reserve plus 8 NCO, totaling:  54.  Take out the reserve and NCO and the total is then 38.

For the Brits:  41 SMGs, plus 15 Stens, plus 8 NCO plus 4 reserve for a total of 67.  Take out the reserve and NCO and the total is 55.

So, the worst-case I see is germans with 55, French with 38, and the Brits with 55.

I did this to check and see if there is a difference between what is coded (what I asked OHM for earlier) and what is making it in-game.  There is no difference that I can see, and there have been no changes to the SMGs spawn list for the past 3 campaigns.  Nothing is broken, and I'm just not seeing hwo you are getting the numbers you are getting.  I've looked at the code, and I've looked at clean garrisons in-game.  Neither show what you are seeing.

 

What you did here is compare the German 2 AB Garrison supply to the Brit and French 1 AB Garrison supply numbers. You need to try your count again but make sure you are looking at a 1 AB town on all sides.

 

10 hours ago, Augetout said:

That is not accurate, simply put.  I was JUST in-game looking at a german garrison, and I have posted the spawn numbers above.  

Actually, it is accurate. Every time I have spot checked things to be sure, it has come up as a perfect match. The numbers are coming directly from CRS wiretap data. There is always a chance something gets lost in parsing the data though - so I'd be open to looking at a specific issue if one is identified. 

 

10 hours ago, tater said:

I guess the charts site is not reflecting the actual numbers.

I simply followed the link given in the other thread. Checking in game is obviously the best answer to the question, which @Augetout just did for us.

 

 

It should be correct. The error was actually in Augetout's comparison.

 

9 hours ago, Augetout said:

Meh.

It turns out I was looking at 1 ab town to 1 ab town, but despite joining the army garrison naval numbers were thrown into the mix.  My humble apologies.

None of that means the numbers are wrong in-game, and I understand the determined search for a reason for losing this campaign other than simply being beaten.  I do not pretend to understand the complexities involved in how the spawn lists are derived, but I am sure there is a logic behind it.  In the end, the spawn lists have not changed in the last 3 campaigns, and again, I apologize for my faulty research.

Phew ..... catching up ..... thanks, glad everything is cleared up. G'day.

[hillstorm]

6 hours ago, Augetout said:

Drop the attitude when someone is apologizing, Delems.  Patience running thin now.   For the record, I spawned into 2 separate French 1 ab no navy towns, and got the same result (24)-----Having said that, I just tried a 3rd and it is 38.  What are the odds that the first 2 French towns I spawned into would both be partially depleted in SMGs only?  I dunno.  So once again I apologize.  Now I am done bothering with this.  Take it up with the game managers.  I did my bit for God and country, and to help figure it all out, and your attitude stinks, giving me the impression I was wasting my time in trying to help.  

Dude. This isn’t my fight, but let me point out your apology started with “Meh,” and included the following snipe:

”None of that means the numbers are wrong in-game, and I understand the determined search for a reason for losing this campaign other than simply being beaten.”

uh, nice? 

[tater]

56 minutes ago, ch0ad said:

It should be correct. The error was actually in Augetout's comparison.

Yeah, I later saw his post about that. Thanks for the site, BTW.

 

 

What's the reason for UK SMG numbers being so high? I have seen some pages suggest that the UK in fact had more SMGs issued per division than any other Army in the West, but in that case they should be almost entirely Stens, not Thompsons. In addition, once 1943 hits, a typical German Gruppe would have had 3 SMGs out of 10 men.