Trawler multi-crew AA.

[delems]

Need to have the AA guns split between the crew.

Not all the AA guns assigned to one crew member.

That way more AA can be firing at once.

[jwilly]

25 minutes ago, delems said:

Need to have the AA guns split between the crew.

Not all the AA guns assigned to one crew member.

That way more AA can be firing at once.

If we can assume Scotsman is authoritative, the development direction will be for none of the AA to be player operated. Instead all of the AA guns will be AI. That'll allow the vessel to be single player operated, with an active helm during attacks...as is needed for realism...and with maximum AA firepower at all times.

[delems]

Hmm, but I want to shoot the Flakverling

[tater]

What @Scotsman said was that for larger units the small AA would have to be AI, because the polys even for the pretty low res player guns we have would be prohibitive. I think the implication was for units with many AI, though it could generalize. For the trawlers retrofitted with AI, I would imagine the AI AA would be the small AA guns, not the quads.

[delems]

OK, guess that tow version of the Flakverling might have to come out a bit sooner then

[BMBM]

I’ve added the vierling to pos1, leaving pos2 with Oerlikons only. The towed vierling will be added eventually.

[undercova]

Yesterday a Hurricane degunned my Vierling with a single strafe. No crew dead or hit. Rest of Trawler was fine. Enemy got a kill on me. 

I could understand if he bombs me and i sink or my main gun (75mm) got hit ... but the Vierling ??

[delems]

Agree, taking out any of the guns on a ship should not get a kill.

Sink the ship, that is the kill.

[tater]

1 hour ago, undercova said:

Yesterday a Hurricane degunned my Vierling with a single strafe. No crew dead or hit. Rest of Trawler was fine. Enemy got a kill on me. 

This has been discussed in other threads, but the crew on the quads is substantially larger than shown. 6-8 men, most of whom are involved with loading. Min crew to point and fire is 1 or 3 depending on how it is pointed. All the guns are like this, and killing crew should perhaps slow relaoding, but not impact the utility of the gun until the crew is below the min capable of pointing/firing. (this is true of army ATG/AAA as well).

[BMBM]

Crew damage has been taken care of too.

[jwilly]

15 minutes ago, tater said:

This has been discussed in other threads, but the crew on the quads is substantially larger than shown. 6-8 men, most of whom are involved with loading. Min crew to point and fire is 1 or 3 depending on how it is pointed. All the guns are like this, and killing crew should perhaps slow relaoding, but not impact the utility of the gun until the crew is below the min capable of pointing/firing. (this is true of army ATG/AAA as well).

The FlaKVierling requires almost continuous loading on both sides. If you're firing two barrels alternately...the normal way of using the gun...it takes 6-7 seconds to empty the current set of magazines if no time is required for reacquisition of target etc., and 5-7 seconds to load a set of magazines depending on the skill of the lead loaders and how far the secondary loaders have to go to replenish the prepared magazine supply. So, one pair of loaders never stops moving, and the other pair spends most of their time moving.

The rest of the crew is a traverser, an elevator, a man setting the predictor gunsights according to target speed and altitude, and the gun commander.

Of course, we don't have realistic gunsights that require continuous adjustment, we don't need commanders, and our ammo arrives magically. So to fire for longer than a few seconds, the minimum practical crew for the game gun-mount firing ammo already within a man's no-turning reach of the gun would be four.

Edited October 21, 2020 by jwilly

[tater]

38 minutes ago, jwilly said:

Of course, we don't have realistic gunsights that require continuous adjustment, we don't need commanders, and our ammo arrives magically. So to fire for longer than a few seconds, the minimum practical crew for the game gun-mount firing ammo already within a man's no-turning reach of the gun would be four.

We need to figure that out for each gun type (all crew weapons in game), then the usual actual crew (including commander, he'd pitch in for sure if they lost someone), and give the guns excess crew "hit points" based on the difference. If a given gun could operate at all with fewer crew, but slower, then that should be a thing (for AAA, might not be effective as AA, since 1 person might literally have to crack elevation, then move to azimuth, then move to firing position—but it could work vs surface targets or simply barrage (slowed by reloading).

[delems]

*** I’ve added the vierling to pos1, leaving pos2 with Oerlikons only.

Great, but I'm wondering, should crew 2 get the quad and 1 get the twins?

1 already has the main gun up front yes?

IDK, just wondering for discussion, that way the 2nd person has fun?

[jwilly]

4 minutes ago, delems said:

1 already has the main gun up front yes?

The "main gun" on an armed trawler would be the multibarrel AA/anti-torpedo-boat mount.

The 75/76/88mm deck gun was there primarily to fire starshells, which we don't even have yet. 

Historically, in many daytime actions it wouldn't even be manned.

[delems]

Yes, but I'm thinking player 1 is manning the helm and maybe using main gun; player 2 then would be primarily for AA, with player 1 helping if can on twins.

Idk, just a thought.